Can I be fined for a terminally-ill parent missing their self assessment deadline before death?

jessthecat_2

Hi
My terminally-ill parent missed their 2023 self-assessment deadline a few months before their death.
When they were first fined, I wrote to HMRC and explained why. They eventually wrote back to say that I wasn't entitled to speak on my parent's behalf, so my explanation would not be considered without my parent's consent for me to speak on their behalf.
I drafted a letter to that effect, but by now my parent was too ill to sign it, and died shortly afterwards.
Today I received a letter fining ME £300 as my parent's representative!

Can they do this?!

jessthecat_2

In my case, there is a will but no living or capable executor, so we have applied for probate but have been told we are several months away from receiving it. So by their own declaration, I not my parent's representative, I am not the executor, we are months away from probate, and they've given me 30 days to pay from a letter dated 16 days before it was actually received!
Just how low can HMRC sink?

elsien

jessthecat_2 said:

In my case, there is a will but no living or capable executor, so we have applied for probate but have been told we are several months away from receiving it. So by their own declaration, I not my parent's representative, I am not the executor, we are months away from probate, and they've given me 30 days to pay from a letter dated 16 days before it was actually received!
Just how low can HMRC sink?

But presumably someone has applied for letters of administration, if there is no executor? So would they not be the person dealing with this?

uknick

jessthecat_2 said:

Hi
My terminally-ill parent missed their 2023 self-assessment deadline a few months before their death.
When they were first fined, I wrote to HMRC and explained why. They eventually wrote back to say that I wasn't entitled to speak on my parent's behalf, so my explanation would not be considered without my parent's consent for me to speak on their behalf.
I drafted a letter to that effect, but by now my parent was too ill to sign it, and died shortly afterwards.
Today I received a letter fining ME £300 as my parent's representative!

Can they do this?!

From what you've written, that the letter never got sent, I'm not sure how they have now designated you their "tax representative".  It looks like you need to call them and put them right.

If they've fined you because they say you're the estate's administrator (I'm not sure how they would know that) then they got that wrong as well.  It's the estate who should be paying the fine, not you.  Not that there should be fine anyway.

horsewithnoname

get your MP involved 

marcia_

[Deleted User] said:

horsewithnoname said:

get your MP involved 

Might be easier to just call HMRC.

 My MP is probably fed up with me. I frequently involve them when getting nowhere or ringing is almost impossible due to the long wait for the phone to be answered 

DullGreyGuy

marcia_ said:

[Deleted User] said:

horsewithnoname said:

get your MP involved 

Might be easier to just call HMRC.

 My MP is probably fed up with me. I frequently involve them when getting nowhere or ringing is almost impossible due to the long wait for the phone to be answered 

My MP is as useful as an underwater hairdryer... when having lots of problems with part of the Home Office contacted him and on the phone he said he'd speak to them etc. After 2 months I finally managed to get the problem sorted. After a further 3 month, 5 months in total, I got an email from the MP saying "please find attached the Home Office's response"... which was a 1 line letter saying the MP wasn't authorised to discuss the matter. Wasn't the only one having problems at the time and plenty of others reported their MP getting the issue fixed in hours. 

Grumpy_chap

OP - sorry for your loss.
The fine, I assume, is on the Estate, and the HMRC have you as the Representative of the Estate (even if incorrectly).
If no one is acting as Executor, then how are the affairs of the Estate being addressed?  Is someone acting as Administrator?
Is the Estate solvent?

sheramber

You need to contact HMRC  and advise them of the current situation so they can update their records as to who is dealing with the probate/estate.

https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/hm-revenue-customs/contact/self-assessment

jessthecat_2

elsien said:

jessthecat_2 said:

In my case, there is a will but no living or capable executor, so we have applied for probate but have been told we are several months away from receiving it. So by their own declaration, I not my parent's representative, I am not the executor, we are months away from probate, and they've given me 30 days to pay from a letter dated 16 days before it was actually received!
Just how low can HMRC sink?

But presumably someone has applied for letters of administration, if there is no executor? So would they not be the person dealing with this?

Yes, we have applied for letters of administration.
But how the hell has the fine transferred to me? Surely a fine dies with the person? It wasn't me that didn't get my tax return in on time!

jessthecat_2

Grumpy_chap said:

OP - sorry for your loss.
The fine, I assume, is on the Estate, and the HMRC have you as the Representative of the Estate (even if incorrectly).
If no one is acting as Executor, then how are the affairs of the Estate being addressed?  Is someone acting as Administrator?
Is the Estate solvent?

We have applied for letters of admin. So far we have received a receipt and told of a 16-week timescale for it to be processed. HMRC have just dived straight in to our grief and given me, personally, a matter of days to pay a fine that isn't even mine. That's beneath contempt.