Not Accepting a Job from Another Company Whilst with Current Classed as Voluntarily Unemploy

Hello, I've been working for a contractor on a site for 13 years and for reasons I can't go into, I want to leave.  The site is managed by a different employer and the contract for cleaning the site maybe going to that different employer rather than the separate employer I'm currently with.  If the different employer offered me the job with them and I didn't accept letting my current employer terminate my employment, would that class me as voluntarily making myself unemployed in the face of benefits?
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  • Markytho said:
    Hello, I've been working for a contractor on a site for 13 years and for reasons I can't go into, I want to leave.  The site is managed by a different employer and the contract for cleaning the site maybe going to that different employer rather than the separate employer I'm currently with.  If the different employer offered me the job with them and I didn't accept letting my current employer terminate my employment, would that class me as voluntarily making myself unemployed in the face of benefits?
    Yes - or at the very least I would certainly hope so as that is exactly what you would be doing!
  • Grumpy_chap
    Grumpy_chap Posts: 14,458
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    Markytho said:
    Hello, I've been working for a contractor on a site for 13 years and for reasons I can't go into, I want to leave.  The site is managed by a different employer and the contract for cleaning the site maybe going to that different employer rather than the separate employer I'm currently with.  If the different employer offered me the job with them and I didn't accept letting my current employer terminate my employment, would that class me as voluntarily making myself unemployed in the face of benefits?
    This is likely to be under TUPE, so the move to the new operating company will be automatic.  I doubt the option of the current employer terminating employment will be available as that would cost the current employer financially.
  • Okay I will keep hoping I can get another job and I'm thinking I might be in more of a chance of getting another job if it's less hours or the minimum wage rather than the real living wage I'm on so time to change tactics with me having difficulty getting another job.  I was just thinking that my job would be terminated because there's no work and the jobcentre wouldn't know if I'd have been offered the same job, but with another company unless they can find out anyway? I invite any comments from anyone else to tell me exactly how they would find out or could as it's risk taking?
  • Marcon
    Marcon Posts: 10,037
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    Markytho said:
    Okay I will keep hoping I can get another job and I'm thinking I might be in more of a chance of getting another job if it's less hours or the minimum wage rather than the real living wage I'm on so time to change tactics with me having difficulty getting another job.  I was just thinking that my job would be terminated because there's no work and the jobcentre wouldn't know if I'd have been offered the same job, but with another company unless they can find out anyway? I invite any comments from anyone else to tell me exactly how they would find out or could as it's risk taking?
    Benefits aren't a lifestyle choice for those who don't like their jobs; they are there for those who actually need them, so expect careful checks.

    You'd need to provide direct written evidence from your current employer of their grounds for dismissing you, which the JobCentre are likely to check with them (so forget the idea of forging or faking anything). In any case, it sounds highly unlikely you'd be made redundant - from the sound of it this would either be a straightforward TUPE transfer or its little cousin 'secondary TUPE'.


    Googling on your question might have been both quicker and easier, if you're only after simple facts rather than opinions!  
  • Marcon thanks for clearing that up for me.  I'll have to stay where I am unless I can get the company to move me to another site even if it's less hours I think I can survive on.  I can't go into details but I made an allegation that everyone knows about even though some have left.  I agree with you that benefits aren't a lifestyle choice but what's stopping someone from getting a temp job after leaving a perm job then going on benefits or having their hours reduced so then they can at least get some benefits? I mean you could be in a job for years then take a temp job.  Anything stopping it
  • stu12345_2
    stu12345_2 Posts: 800
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    edited 27 December 2023 at 4:08PM
    I hated a job and left it to take a temp job. the temp job ended. I signed on. the DSS asked why did I leave my last job. I stated temp contract ended.
     I got full dole money.as that is exactly what happened 

    pay your debt at your rate.not what the creditor demands.cos they have no power.they aren't the police.
  • Markytho
    Markytho Posts: 22
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    edited 27 December 2023 at 4:37PM
    Stu thanks for clearing that up for me because I often wondered about that so I see it's a technicality.  Thanks also to Grumpy_chap.  I eventually got evidence for my allegation, but at first failed and I believe I was suspected of doing what I was alleged to have done by him to get him but I think everyone just thought I was mental because of the way I am rather than tying my allegation and what I was alleged to have done together.  I think he just thought I was using psychology and wasn't capable or possible why he was still doing what he was doing, but I said nothing when I succeeded and he's long left so got away with it.  The regret's worse now than it's ever been because I don't know if I really would've got sacked for doing something illegal to get evidence as I feel I had a good reason so my thinking was wrong and what you wonder about you regret the most for if I'd have got sacked I'd have had nothing to wonder about.  I've found it difficult to get employment you see but at least I would've been able to show I've been wronged.

    At least my ex-supervisor knows I was telling the truth and he's the only one who knows I was so that's something.
  • stu12345_2
    stu12345_2 Posts: 800
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    edited 27 December 2023 at 5:06PM
    I also once many years ago left a horrible job and became a self employed taxi driver. I did it for a few months but ended up losing too much money in expenses
     I shut my self employment down and signed on and stated business was unsustainable. there were too many taxis in town and too few passengers .in the midweek dayshift
    think I was making about £3 an hour when min wage was £7., rental alone before fuel was £220 a week.
    the guy I rented taxi from, would not give me car on a Friday or Saturday night where the money was to be made.
    signed on with no problem.
     the temp job I took in was a campsite that only ran for 7 months. it wasn't my fault the site closed.
     like I wrote got dole money no problem.
    the only hassle I see if the rules have changed and they asked why did you leave jobs in last 6 months.and you have to mention current job. and temp job , if your temp job is less than 6 months, but haven't signed on in years, so need clarification 

     but when I did it , it was only asked why did you leave LAST job 

    I remember a question would you still be employed if you didn't leave job

    I wrote no, as the campsite closed for winter.

    an extreme example is when I moved home over 100 miles to a better area with more job opportunities and I had to resign as could not commute 200 miles daily on a min wage.partime job.. signed on, but had arguments with dole, but won it.

    so don't get sacked from your current job, look for permanent jobs or take a temp job.
    or via an agency that states job is temp to permanent to correct person
    pay your debt at your rate.not what the creditor demands.cos they have no power.they aren't the police.
  • EnPointe
    EnPointe Posts: 259
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    edited 27 December 2023 at 9:16PM
    Markytho said:
    Hello, I've been working for a contractor on a site for 13 years and for reasons I can't go into, I want to leave.  The site is managed by a different employer and the contract for cleaning the site maybe going to that different employer rather than the separate employer I'm currently with.  If the different employer offered me the job with them and I didn't accept letting my current employer terminate my employment, would that class me as voluntarily making myself unemployed in the face of benefits?
    This is likely to be under TUPE, so the move to the new operating company will be automatic.  I doubt the option of the current employer terminating employment will be available as that would cost the current employer financially.
    Termination by old employer is an option but it is viewed as Resignation not redundnacy as the job still exists on thesame terms under the TUPE
  • Thank you very much, Stu and EnPointe.  I've looked at agency jobs and have been unsure whether to go for them because they can get rid of you without any reason, but then taking a permanent job comes with a probationary period and if you've been in a job for less then 2 years then they don't need to have a good reason to get rid of you.  I agree that being on benefits shouldn't be a lifestyle choice and not to say I am, but what if you're being bullied in a workplace or you made an allegation like I did that's stuck with you and while you can prove it was true you didn't at the time so if you did now you'd become even more of a laughing stock? It's not something you can always prove to the jobcentre and even if you could you might not want to because it could be something of a laughable nature? I guess if it's temp to perm via an agency then they're less likely to get rid of you and will just let the temp part run its course first.  Just don't trust agencies going by past experiences but they should keep in mind I left a long running perm job so think of it
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