Sacked? Redundancy? Advice needed please

Hello , can anyone possibly help me. I’ve worked for a company for nearly 6 years as progressed within the company. The company as no HR department however, has recently onboarded a HR consultant who has brought in staff 1-1’s the last 4 months.
my most recent 1-1 the owner of the company sat in as they were aware that I wasn’t happy. I have gone through numerous spells in the last feeling unhappy but then it passes. 
What’s different this time is I’m also stressed with finances as things keep going up. My mortgage is due for renewal. My energy has now gone up etc and they are aware I’ve looked as employment elsewhere. I advised that this was a very brief look and I’d applied for another role however, I was definitely not intent on leaving and my focus was to remain with the company and I’d only had a brief look as I can’t live my life struggling. 
The 1-1 ended with the feeling of they will see what they can maybe do for me and I even got asked to email the owner my monthly outgoings. 

Today I was taken back into a meeting with the HR consultant and was told that a few maters had been raised so these matters were given to me and they have no substance - they’re ridiculous and it became apparent that I shouldn’t have been honest in my 1-1 and they saw me looking elsewhere as a taking it personally kind of thing. 
The matters that they raised have never been raised with me formally or informally and I have never faced any sort of disciplinary action. 
The owner advised that he will write to me with a financial settlement and im hopefully going to sign it with a non disclosure agreement. 
From what I could gather - If I don’t sign it they will then have to go down the disciplinary route and conduct an investigation and I’m fearful that fictions things will be out together and the outcome will be dismissal on whatever grounds. 
I had my company car taken off me and had to get a taxi home and leave belongings in the car and advised they will be posted. 
The settler figure is affective however - it doesn’t sit right with me. I’ve done nothing wrong and worked extremely hard for them for years. 
I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
So now I have no job and no car. 
I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
«1

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  • Marcon
    Marcon Posts: 10,019
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    jcowap said:
    Hello , can anyone possibly help me. I’ve worked for a company for nearly 6 years as progressed within the company. The company as no HR department however, has recently onboarded a HR consultant who has brought in staff 1-1’s the last 4 months.
    my most recent 1-1 the owner of the company sat in as they were aware that I wasn’t happy. I have gone through numerous spells in the last feeling unhappy but then it passes. 
    What’s different this time is I’m also stressed with finances as things keep going up. My mortgage is due for renewal. My energy has now gone up etc and they are aware I’ve looked as employment elsewhere. I advised that this was a very brief look and I’d applied for another role however, I was definitely not intent on leaving and my focus was to remain with the company and I’d only had a brief look as I can’t live my life struggling. 
    The 1-1 ended with the feeling of they will see what they can maybe do for me and I even got asked to email the owner my monthly outgoings. 

    Today I was taken back into a meeting with the HR consultant and was told that a few maters had been raised so these matters were given to me and they have no substance - they’re ridiculous and it became apparent that I shouldn’t have been honest in my 1-1 and they saw me looking elsewhere as a taking it personally kind of thing. 
    The matters that they raised have never been raised with me formally or informally and I have never faced any sort of disciplinary action. 
    The owner advised that he will write to me with a financial settlement and im hopefully going to sign it with a non disclosure agreement. 
    From what I could gather - If I don’t sign it they will then have to go down the disciplinary route and conduct an investigation and I’m fearful that fictions things will be out together and the outcome will be dismissal on whatever grounds. 
    I had my company car taken off me and had to get a taxi home and leave belongings in the car and advised they will be posted. 
    The settler figure is affective however - it doesn’t sit right with me. I’ve done nothing wrong and worked extremely hard for them for years. 
    I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
    So now I have no job and no car. 
    I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
    I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
    If it's as unfair and as unexpected as you say, then it's no surprise it doesn't sit right.

    It isn't redundancy unless the requirement for your job no longer exists or has substantially diminished - neither of which seems to be the case here.

    You don't have to say anything on the spot; they've made the opening offer and you need to have a think about things once the initial shock has started to wear off a bit. Without knowing how much you earn it's impossible to know how generous or otherwise that offer is. I'd start by asking for confirmation that they will pay your legal costs for advice and discuss it with a specialist employment lawyer.
    Googling on your question might have been both quicker and easier, if you're only after simple facts rather than opinions!  
  • jcowap
    jcowap Posts: 17
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    Marcon said:
    jcowap said:
    Hello , can anyone possibly help me. I’ve worked for a company for nearly 6 years as progressed within the company. The company as no HR department however, has recently onboarded a HR consultant who has brought in staff 1-1’s the last 4 months.
    my most recent 1-1 the owner of the company sat in as they were aware that I wasn’t happy. I have gone through numerous spells in the last feeling unhappy but then it passes. 
    What’s different this time is I’m also stressed with finances as things keep going up. My mortgage is due for renewal. My energy has now gone up etc and they are aware I’ve looked as employment elsewhere. I advised that this was a very brief look and I’d applied for another role however, I was definitely not intent on leaving and my focus was to remain with the company and I’d only had a brief look as I can’t live my life struggling. 
    The 1-1 ended with the feeling of they will see what they can maybe do for me and I even got asked to email the owner my monthly outgoings. 

    Today I was taken back into a meeting with the HR consultant and was told that a few maters had been raised so these matters were given to me and they have no substance - they’re ridiculous and it became apparent that I shouldn’t have been honest in my 1-1 and they saw me looking elsewhere as a taking it personally kind of thing. 
    The matters that they raised have never been raised with me formally or informally and I have never faced any sort of disciplinary action. 
    The owner advised that he will write to me with a financial settlement and im hopefully going to sign it with a non disclosure agreement. 
    From what I could gather - If I don’t sign it they will then have to go down the disciplinary route and conduct an investigation and I’m fearful that fictions things will be out together and the outcome will be dismissal on whatever grounds. 
    I had my company car taken off me and had to get a taxi home and leave belongings in the car and advised they will be posted. 
    The settler figure is affective however - it doesn’t sit right with me. I’ve done nothing wrong and worked extremely hard for them for years. 
    I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
    So now I have no job and no car. 
    I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
    I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
    If it's as unfair and as unexpected as you say, then it's no surprise it doesn't sit right.

    It isn't redundancy unless the requirement for your job no longer exists or has substantially diminished - neither of which seems to be the case here.

    You don't have to say anything on the spot; they've made the opening offer and you need to have a think about things once the initial shock has started to wear off a bit. Without knowing how much you earn it's impossible to know how generous or otherwise that offer is. I'd start by asking for confirmation that they will pay your legal costs for advice and discuss it with a specialist employment lawyer.


    Hello - salary at point of leaning £32,000 per year with company car. 

    I suppose my next steps are to check who is covering legal costs for myself and then als what their proposed settlement figure is and see if I wish to counter it and yes If they will cover my legal costs then I can ask all of the questions I like 
  • Andy_L
    Andy_L Posts: 12,744
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    jcowap said:

    I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
    So now I have no job and no car. 
    I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
    I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
    As a starting point statutory redundancy would be about £3.5k
    https://www.gov.uk/redundancy-your-rights/redundancy-pay
    Although, as marcon said, this isn't a redundancy situation
  • jlfrs01
    jlfrs01 Posts: 279
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    You need to speak with a Lawyer who specialises in Employment Law pronto. I had a similar thing happen to me a few years ago. For a start, involving a Lawyer takes you out of the firing line, secondly they'll be able to advise you of your options and the possible outcome, you'll usually get an initial phone call for free and can go from there. I don't believe your employer had any right to confiscte your car, if it forms part of your contract then you should be entitled to it until the day you leave the company (or if you change jobs internally for one which doesn't include one).

    What you employer is suggesting is a fait accompli - accept their offer to leave or face a Disciplinary. This is the government's advice on Disciplinary procedures:

    https://www.gov.uk/disciplinary-procedures-and-action-at-work/disciplinary-hearings

    If it's a matter of taking an offer then in effect you are waiving your legal rights under UK employment law and accepting a "Compromise Agreement". If you feel your position is untenable then this may be the route to go and you don't have to accept what they're putting on the table, a Lawyer can negotiate this for you and it is usually the employer who bears all costs. If you can get redundancy then some of your settlement could be tax-free.


  • Marcon
    Marcon Posts: 10,019
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    jcowap said:
    Marcon said:
    jcowap said:
    Hello , can anyone possibly help me. I’ve worked for a company for nearly 6 years as progressed within the company. The company as no HR department however, has recently onboarded a HR consultant who has brought in staff 1-1’s the last 4 months.
    my most recent 1-1 the owner of the company sat in as they were aware that I wasn’t happy. I have gone through numerous spells in the last feeling unhappy but then it passes. 
    What’s different this time is I’m also stressed with finances as things keep going up. My mortgage is due for renewal. My energy has now gone up etc and they are aware I’ve looked as employment elsewhere. I advised that this was a very brief look and I’d applied for another role however, I was definitely not intent on leaving and my focus was to remain with the company and I’d only had a brief look as I can’t live my life struggling. 
    The 1-1 ended with the feeling of they will see what they can maybe do for me and I even got asked to email the owner my monthly outgoings. 

    Today I was taken back into a meeting with the HR consultant and was told that a few maters had been raised so these matters were given to me and they have no substance - they’re ridiculous and it became apparent that I shouldn’t have been honest in my 1-1 and they saw me looking elsewhere as a taking it personally kind of thing. 
    The matters that they raised have never been raised with me formally or informally and I have never faced any sort of disciplinary action. 
    The owner advised that he will write to me with a financial settlement and im hopefully going to sign it with a non disclosure agreement. 
    From what I could gather - If I don’t sign it they will then have to go down the disciplinary route and conduct an investigation and I’m fearful that fictions things will be out together and the outcome will be dismissal on whatever grounds. 
    I had my company car taken off me and had to get a taxi home and leave belongings in the car and advised they will be posted. 
    The settler figure is affective however - it doesn’t sit right with me. I’ve done nothing wrong and worked extremely hard for them for years. 
    I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
    So now I have no job and no car. 
    I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
    I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
    If it's as unfair and as unexpected as you say, then it's no surprise it doesn't sit right.

    It isn't redundancy unless the requirement for your job no longer exists or has substantially diminished - neither of which seems to be the case here.

    You don't have to say anything on the spot; they've made the opening offer and you need to have a think about things once the initial shock has started to wear off a bit. Without knowing how much you earn it's impossible to know how generous or otherwise that offer is. I'd start by asking for confirmation that they will pay your legal costs for advice and discuss it with a specialist employment lawyer.


    Hello - salary at point of leaning £32,000 per year with company car. 


    Then that's not a particularly generous settlement offer, especially as the 'two months pay' appears to include pay in lieu of notice.


    Googling on your question might have been both quicker and easier, if you're only after simple facts rather than opinions!  
  • Undervalued
    Undervalued Posts: 8,817
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    edited 8 November 2023 at 3:29PM
    jlfrs01 said:
    You need to speak with a Lawyer who specialises in Employment Law pronto. I had a similar thing happen to me a few years ago. For a start, involving a Lawyer takes you out of the firing line, secondly they'll be able to advise you of your options and the possible outcome, you'll usually get an initial phone call for free and can go from there. I don't believe your employer had any right to confiscte your car, if it forms part of your contract then you should be entitled to it until the day you leave the company (or if you change jobs internally for one which doesn't include one).

    What you employer is suggesting is a fait accompli - accept their offer to leave or face a Disciplinary. This is the government's advice on Disciplinary procedures:

    https://www.gov.uk/disciplinary-procedures-and-action-at-work/disciplinary-hearings

    If it's a matter of taking an offer then in effect you are waiving your legal rights under UK employment law and accepting a "Compromise Agreement". If you feel your position is untenable then this may be the route to go and you don't have to accept what they're putting on the table, a Lawyer can negotiate this for you and it is usually the employer who bears all costs. If you can get redundancy then some of your settlement could be tax-free.


    1 - Now called a "Settlement Agreement" (changed from a compromise agreement about ten years ago)!

    2- For it to be valid the employee must receive independent legal advice so that they understand the implications of signing. Whilst it is customary (not obligatory) for the employer to pay towards this it is unusual for them to pay for more legal advice than the minimum the law requires for the agreement to be valid. It is most unusual for the employer to pay for the employee's lawyer to negotiate for a better settlement!

    3 - This is not a redundancy situation however, that is irrelevant as the first £30K of a settlement agreement is also tax free. Any contractual entitlements such as notice and holiday pay would be taxable in the normal way.
  • jcowap
    jcowap Posts: 17
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    Forumite
    Marcon said:
    jcowap said:
    Marcon said:
    jcowap said:
    Hello , can anyone possibly help me. I’ve worked for a company for nearly 6 years as progressed within the company. The company as no HR department however, has recently onboarded a HR consultant who has brought in staff 1-1’s the last 4 months.
    my most recent 1-1 the owner of the company sat in as they were aware that I wasn’t happy. I have gone through numerous spells in the last feeling unhappy but then it passes. 
    What’s different this time is I’m also stressed with finances as things keep going up. My mortgage is due for renewal. My energy has now gone up etc and they are aware I’ve looked as employment elsewhere. I advised that this was a very brief look and I’d applied for another role however, I was definitely not intent on leaving and my focus was to remain with the company and I’d only had a brief look as I can’t live my life struggling. 
    The 1-1 ended with the feeling of they will see what they can maybe do for me and I even got asked to email the owner my monthly outgoings. 

    Today I was taken back into a meeting with the HR consultant and was told that a few maters had been raised so these matters were given to me and they have no substance - they’re ridiculous and it became apparent that I shouldn’t have been honest in my 1-1 and they saw me looking elsewhere as a taking it personally kind of thing. 
    The matters that they raised have never been raised with me formally or informally and I have never faced any sort of disciplinary action. 
    The owner advised that he will write to me with a financial settlement and im hopefully going to sign it with a non disclosure agreement. 
    From what I could gather - If I don’t sign it they will then have to go down the disciplinary route and conduct an investigation and I’m fearful that fictions things will be out together and the outcome will be dismissal on whatever grounds. 
    I had my company car taken off me and had to get a taxi home and leave belongings in the car and advised they will be posted. 
    The settler figure is affective however - it doesn’t sit right with me. I’ve done nothing wrong and worked extremely hard for them for years. 
    I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
    So now I have no job and no car. 
    I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
    I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
    If it's as unfair and as unexpected as you say, then it's no surprise it doesn't sit right.

    It isn't redundancy unless the requirement for your job no longer exists or has substantially diminished - neither of which seems to be the case here.

    You don't have to say anything on the spot; they've made the opening offer and you need to have a think about things once the initial shock has started to wear off a bit. Without knowing how much you earn it's impossible to know how generous or otherwise that offer is. I'd start by asking for confirmation that they will pay your legal costs for advice and discuss it with a specialist employment lawyer.


    Hello - salary at point of leaning £32,000 per year with company car. 


    Then that's not a particularly generous settlement offer, especially as the 'two months pay' appears to include pay in lieu of notice.


    Hello, so after 5 full years service on a wage of £32k with a company car and having never being brought in for disciplinary action etc - £3500 and 2 months pay also I should be counter offering ?  
  • And you will want a good reference, don't overlook that.
  • You could ask to keep the car for a few months. I was settled out of a job and they let me keep my company car for the notice period even though I was paid in lieu. 
  • Marcon
    Marcon Posts: 10,019
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    Forumite
    jcowap said:
    Marcon said:
    jcowap said:
    Marcon said:
    jcowap said:
    Hello , can anyone possibly help me. I’ve worked for a company for nearly 6 years as progressed within the company. The company as no HR department however, has recently onboarded a HR consultant who has brought in staff 1-1’s the last 4 months.
    my most recent 1-1 the owner of the company sat in as they were aware that I wasn’t happy. I have gone through numerous spells in the last feeling unhappy but then it passes. 
    What’s different this time is I’m also stressed with finances as things keep going up. My mortgage is due for renewal. My energy has now gone up etc and they are aware I’ve looked as employment elsewhere. I advised that this was a very brief look and I’d applied for another role however, I was definitely not intent on leaving and my focus was to remain with the company and I’d only had a brief look as I can’t live my life struggling. 
    The 1-1 ended with the feeling of they will see what they can maybe do for me and I even got asked to email the owner my monthly outgoings. 

    Today I was taken back into a meeting with the HR consultant and was told that a few maters had been raised so these matters were given to me and they have no substance - they’re ridiculous and it became apparent that I shouldn’t have been honest in my 1-1 and they saw me looking elsewhere as a taking it personally kind of thing. 
    The matters that they raised have never been raised with me formally or informally and I have never faced any sort of disciplinary action. 
    The owner advised that he will write to me with a financial settlement and im hopefully going to sign it with a non disclosure agreement. 
    From what I could gather - If I don’t sign it they will then have to go down the disciplinary route and conduct an investigation and I’m fearful that fictions things will be out together and the outcome will be dismissal on whatever grounds. 
    I had my company car taken off me and had to get a taxi home and leave belongings in the car and advised they will be posted. 
    The settler figure is affective however - it doesn’t sit right with me. I’ve done nothing wrong and worked extremely hard for them for years. 
    I intend to counter their financial settlement with another figure as the owner was initially asking me to write down a figure but what am I meant to say on  the spot - £500? £10,000 etc . In the end he said £3.5 k and 2 months pay. 
    So now I have no job and no car. 
    I spoke with ACAS and they advised something like if I won at level 1 tribunal I would get the equivalent  of redundancy a weeks pay for every full years service but then  I could explore the compensation aspect of matters. 
    I may just take the settlement and be done with it and I presume that’s the advice I will be given but as I said it just doesn’t sit right with me at all. Here’s a chunk of money, sign here to say you’ll take no further action, here’s a taxi your stuff will be posted. 
    If it's as unfair and as unexpected as you say, then it's no surprise it doesn't sit right.

    It isn't redundancy unless the requirement for your job no longer exists or has substantially diminished - neither of which seems to be the case here.

    You don't have to say anything on the spot; they've made the opening offer and you need to have a think about things once the initial shock has started to wear off a bit. Without knowing how much you earn it's impossible to know how generous or otherwise that offer is. I'd start by asking for confirmation that they will pay your legal costs for advice and discuss it with a specialist employment lawyer.


    Hello - salary at point of leaning £32,000 per year with company car. 


    Then that's not a particularly generous settlement offer, especially as the 'two months pay' appears to include pay in lieu of notice.


    Hello, so after 5 full years service on a wage of £32k with a company car and having never being brought in for disciplinary action etc - £3500 and 2 months pay also I should be counter offering ?  
    You should be counter offering if you're not happy with that figure. You've not mentioned the value of benefits, but you clearly had a company car, and I suspect pension contributions, possibly medical cover and other perks? Factor those in - and also consider how quickly you are likely to be able to get a comparable job which offers remuneration of similar overall value.
    Googling on your question might have been both quicker and easier, if you're only after simple facts rather than opinions!  
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