Financial split - mum in care

tigerspill

Hi,
I am not sure if this is the right forum for this question, but asking here as I know there are many knowledgeable people here.  If there is a more appropriate forum, let me know.

My mum has gone into permanent care - self funded - and I am trying to help my dad sort out his finances.  Specifically how to manage their cash between them.

Most of their working cash is in a joint account and we are going through the process of splittin these into sole accounts.  This is to make things simpler and I must emphasise this is not to try and avoid or reduce my mums assets.  We just want it to be right.

The specific question is about who should pay for household bills such as Rates (we are in NI, but this is similar to council tax) and Utilities such as electricity.  The house in held in their joint names.

Giving that the Rates are associated with the property, my thinking is that this should be paid jointly.  But the likes of electricity/phone etc. should be paid by my dad as it is only him living in the property and using these services.

Does this seem reasonable?

Thanks for any pointers and help.

born_again

Joint accounts 50/50 split.
Rates should just be for your dad (single person discount in NI?)

JGB1955

You could take the view that your father is now a sole householder and needs to pay all the associated costs.  Your mother now lives elsewhere and now has far higher living costs  to contend with.  That's the dispassionate view though  - I'm not sure there is a definitive answer to your question......

Brie

Nothing the matter with joint accounts particularly if your dad is going to have to manage them all if your mom's not capable.  Likewise, in my opinion, it's their joint property so the cost of running it is joint, even if mom's not living there.  Should it ever get to the point of the council needing to fund care they won't take the value of the house into account as your dad is living there and they will acknowledge that he may need some of your mom's money (pension etc) to maintain the property.  Frankly in my opinion the only thing he is getting exclusive use of is money spent on food.  Even having a phone means that he can contact the care home, your mom, give you updates etc.

If it makes life easier to split money into his and hers accounts how about if you are joint on everything as a fall back for your dad?  

xylophone

 OP, regarding the rates, is this relevant to your circumstances?

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/lone-pensioner-allowance#:~:text=Ratepayers aged 70 or over,allowance is not means-tested.

elsien

Brie said:

Nothing the matter with joint accounts particularly if your dad is going to have to manage them all if your mom's not capable.  Likewise, in my opinion, it's their joint property so the cost of running it is joint, even if mom's not living there.  Should it ever get to the point of the council needing to fund care they won't take the value of the house into account as your dad is living there and they will acknowledge that he may need some of your mom's money (pension etc) to maintain the property.  Frankly in my opinion the only thing he is getting exclusive use of is money spent on food.  Even having a phone means that he can contact the care home, your mom, give you updates etc.

If it makes life easier to split money into his and hers accounts how about if you are joint on everything as a fall back for your dad?  

Mum is paying quite a lot to live where she is now. Continuing to pay towards all the household expenses in a property she’s not living in and not returning to would be  difficult to justify as being in her best interests, do you not think? 

tigerspill

elsien said:

Brie said:

Nothing the matter with joint accounts particularly if your dad is going to have to manage them all if your mom's not capable.  Likewise, in my opinion, it's their joint property so the cost of running it is joint, even if mom's not living there.  Should it ever get to the point of the council needing to fund care they won't take the value of the house into account as your dad is living there and they will acknowledge that he may need some of your mom's money (pension etc) to maintain the property.  Frankly in my opinion the only thing he is getting exclusive use of is money spent on food.  Even having a phone means that he can contact the care home, your mom, give you updates etc.

If it makes life easier to split money into his and hers accounts how about if you are joint on everything as a fall back for your dad?  

Mum is paying quite a lot to live where she is now. Continuing to pay towards all the household expenses in a property she’s not living in and not returning to would be  difficult to justify as being in her best interests, do you not think? 

I guess my point is that while my mum isnt living in the property, she does have a 50% financial interest in the property.  And there are expenses directly associated with "owning" the property regardless of where she is living (Rates in NI are for the property regardless of who is living there but will check if they are discounted for a single person living there).  Where as, utilities and services are more associated with using and living in the property rather than ownership.  I think this was the distinction I was thibking about.

tigerspill

xylophone said:

 OP, regarding the rates, is this relevant to your circumstances?

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/lone-pensioner-allowance#:~:text=Ratepayers aged 70 or over,allowance is not means-tested.

Thanks.  I will have a read at this.

elsien

tigerspill said:

elsien said:

Brie said:

Nothing the matter with joint accounts particularly if your dad is going to have to manage them all if your mom's not capable.  Likewise, in my opinion, it's their joint property so the cost of running it is joint, even if mom's not living there.  Should it ever get to the point of the council needing to fund care they won't take the value of the house into account as your dad is living there and they will acknowledge that he may need some of your mom's money (pension etc) to maintain the property.  Frankly in my opinion the only thing he is getting exclusive use of is money spent on food.  Even having a phone means that he can contact the care home, your mom, give you updates etc.

If it makes life easier to split money into his and hers accounts how about if you are joint on everything as a fall back for your dad?  

Mum is paying quite a lot to live where she is now. Continuing to pay towards all the household expenses in a property she’s not living in and not returning to would be  difficult to justify as being in her best interests, do you not think? 

I guess my point is that while my mum isnt living in the property, she does have a 50% financial interest in the property.  And there are expenses directly associated with "owning" the property regardless of where she is living (Rates in NI are for the property regardless of who is living there but will check if they are discounted for a single person living there).  Where as, utilities and services are more associated with using and living in the property rather than ownership.  I think this was the distinction I was thibking about.

My comment was aimed at Brie talking about things like still paying half the phone bill etc, which I do think is  a step too far. 

GrubbyGirl_2

Get in touch with Age UK, they are brilliant at sorting things out and know all the rules