Would I really need an EV Home Charger?

Netexporter

QrizB said:

Reed_Richards said:

It will be done in less than 7 hours if I fork out for a Home Charger but not with the "Granny Charger" (3-pin plug) that I am using at the moment.  So I have to pay £500 or more to get a lie-in.

You could use a £10 time switch on the granny charger, to shut it off at 7am. Or a similarly-priced smart switch, if you're that way inclined.

I'd be wary of doing that. 2.3kW sounds well inside the limit of a 13A rated circuit but with the very long duration it is surprising how much heat can be generated at the slightest hint of a high resistance.

Reed_Richards

The main problem I see with using a time switch is that my charger is plugged in to one of those covered outdoor sockets.  I would have to plug-in an extension cord and plug the time switch into that then find a way to protect it from the weather.  This would add a layer of unsafety to the charging process.  The answer for me is to spend some time rearranging the contents of my garage so I can actually get the car inside it to charge there.

1961Nick

Reed_Richards said:

The main problem I see with using a time switch is that my charger is plugged in to one of those covered outdoor sockets.  I would have to plug-in an extension cord and plug the time switch into that then find a way to protect it from the weather.  This would add a layer of unsafety to the charging process.  The answer for me is to spend some time rearranging the contents of my garage so I can actually get the car inside it to charge there.

You could fit a Wifi fused spur where your socket is now & another enclosure next to it for the socket.

https://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/SMFSTWIFITU.html?source=adwords&ad_position=&ad_id=&placement=&kw=&network=x&matchtype=&ad_type=pla&product_id=SMFSTWIFITU&product_partition_id=&campaign=shopping_excluded&version=finalurl_v3&gclid=CjwKCAjw69moBhBgEiwAUFCx2Ft-FcAL_G7zfDqRq6AFioWlCnhaRwtGpvuWDLwqFV86c4Q1wMZmcBoCPMYQAvD_BwE

https://www.toolstation.com/wessex-ip66-accessory-enclosure/p61122?utm_source=googleshopping&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=googleshoppingfeed&mkwid=_dc&pcrid=&pkw=&pmt=&gclid=CjwKCAjw69moBhBgEiwAUFCx2PexckuLCusL8CY-kYbAqXLGTMvhqwQ9AROhfn_ZjPAKpi_7M_L8mRoC7_IQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Qyburn

silverwhistle said:
Standard 13A plug sockets are not designed for continuous high level draw, nor do they have PEN protection.

I use a commando plug and an OHME charger 

Does your OHME charger detect loss of PEN? It's not a concern for us as our supply is TNS but I wondered why one type of plug in charger would support this while another apparently can't. How does detection work?

Reed_Richards

I hate acronyms.  Is this what you mean https://www.thepencompany.com/blog/pens/4-tips-for-not-losing-your-pens/ ?

Qyburn

PEN is combined earth and neutral conductor, and the issue to be addressed is that if this is broken things can continue to work but induce dangerous voltages on any earthed items.

https://matt-e.co.uk/electric-vehicle-connection-units/

dunstonh

We had a pod point installed.    It took 4 months to get installed from purchase as we needed some of our electrics around the consumer unit updated (RCA time delay and some thicker wiring).  It needed the supplier to upgrade the meter tails and needed UK Power Networks to install 100amp fuse (we had 60amp previously).    We have 1 main consumer unit and 6 more across the barns, stables and garages.   Only the main one needed some updating.  The podpoint is connected to one of the external consumer boards.

So, during that first 4 months we used the 3 pin plug.  That was good for about 15kWh over the 7 hour off peak period under economy 7.   15kW gave us about 35 miles in summer and 25 in winter.

That is fine for my wife and about 80% of her journeys.  However, I am going electric on one of my other cars soon and I need greater range and therefore more than a granny plug.   

The podpoint has on/off timers on it to match charging times but needs adjusting when the clocks change as multi-rate tariffs go by GMT not BST.  i.e. its currently 1.30 to 8.30 BST but is 12.30 to 7.30GMT.  

ptrichardson

Reed_Richards said:

I am thinking about buying an EV and wondering why I would need a Home Charger.  There's already a pair of external sockets on the outside wall of my garage so I could plug an electric car into one of those and charge at maybe 3 kW.  A Home Charger would give me 7 kW.  If I average 150 miles a week and can get a modest 3 miles per kWh that would be 50 kWh per week or roughly 7 kWh per day.  So if I use cheap overnight charging I need less than 3 hours per night to keep the car battery topped-up.  There's no benefit that I can see of charging in one hour rather than 3.  The electric cars I am looking at have a range of about 200 miles, my maximum typical journey is 100 miles so I'm never going to find myself in a situation when I need to do anything more than top-up the battery.  Home Chargers are hugely expensive and I don't see what I would be getting for the money.   

Same situation.  Just bought a used 24khw Leaf.  Its for short daily trips - dropping kids off, going to work - about 5miles of travelling per day 3 days a week, plus short trips at weekends that we cannot think will ever be more than 50miles.
3 kids though, so any time all 5 of us need to go together OR any time we need to go further, the diesel people carrier on the drive will be called for.

I can't think of any reason to buy a "proper" EV charger.  The car only charges at 3.3kW max anyway (except quick charge stations of course, but that's not what you have at home).  So the "granny" charger at 10A 230v will drop about 2kW into the car after losses.  Doesn't make much sense forking out over a grand for 50% faster charging imo.

The big thing I've just realised though, is that I also don't see the value in EV tariffs.  I've just ran the numbers using my real last 12 month's electricity use, and my forecasted requirements for the new EV driving 4000 miles per year (and I think it'll be much less in reality).  The benefit of the cheap overnight rates is entirely swallowed up - and more - by the higher daytime rates.
Hell, even if I bought the compatible charger for the best EV rate on the market, I'd be £60 per year better off - and if I had any unexpected day time charging requirements, that would disappear pretty quickly.  I just don't see the point?

So I guess real EV Chargers and EV Tariffs are only for those who have big capacities and plan to travel larger distances.

Reed_Richards

I have discovered that you can buy WiFi-controlled switched outdoor sockets.  Screwfix sell one   https://www.screwfix.com/p/british-general-ip66-13a-2-gang-sp-weatherproof-outdoor-switched-smart-wi-fi-controlled-socket/894pg and there is at least one other.  I believe these allow you to set a schedule for on and off to take advantage of cheaper night time rates.  One of these in combination with my "granny charger" is probably all I need, up until the time when V2H becomes a reality.  I just have to check that my WIFi reaches as far as I would need it to.

In my case I have started using the night time rate to heat my hot water and start the heating earlier (I have a heat pump).  I also charge the battery on my solar panels now we have shorter hours of sunshine.  I hope that doing all these will make the EV tariff work for me, despite the fact that I have to pay more for my day rate electricity.

Although EVs are supposed to have lower running costs, I wonder if the calculations take into account the cost of the Home Charger, not to mention higher insurance costs,  

dunstonh

The big thing I've just realised though, is that I also don't see the value in EV tariffs.  I've just ran the numbers using my real last 12 month's electricity use, and my forecasted requirements for the new EV driving 4000 miles per year (and I think it'll be much less in reality).  The benefit of the cheap overnight rates is entirely swallowed up - and more - by the higher daytime rates.

It all comes down to your ratio of off peak vs peak.    Its a common subject in the Energy forum, albeit more on economy 7 as that is the most popular.  Some suppliers price the off peak rate very low and therefore the peak rate very high and something in between (think of a see saw where if you push down on one, it increases the other).

Some suppliers target those at around 70% off peak use.  Others target those with around 30% off peak use.

Hell, even if I bought the compatible charger for the best EV rate on the market, I'd be £60 per year better off - and if I had any unexpected day time charging requirements, that would disappear pretty quickly.  I just don't see the point?

You dont need an EV tariff.  Economy 7 is often just as good if not better.