Buying Class 2 voluntary contributions from France

HeparGirl24

Hello Forum

Please could help with my sister's situation.  She wants to know if she should be trying to buy back some of her missing 11 years now or can she leave it until nearer 2033?

This is the situation

Pension forecast as at 29 September 2022

Retirement date May 2033
Pension forecast = £121.61
COPE = £12.15

1982 - 2005 all full qualifying years
2006 to present (works/employed in France)

She intends to stop work in March 2025 when her husband gets a pension.  They may return to the UK or decide to stay in France but which ever it is she doesn't intend to work again.

She doesn't want to contact the pensions helpline right now for obvious reasons especially if it makes no difference as to how many years she can buy and when. On the other hand she doesn't want to leave it too late and risk losing some of the years she could have bought.

Many thanks

Brie

I think there's a time limit of going back a max of 6 years so the sooner the better if she wants to get this sorted.  

jem16

Brie said:

I think there's a time limit of going back a max of 6 years so the sooner the better if she wants to get this sorted.  

Until April 2025 you can go all the way back to 2006. 

HeparGirl24

Thanks for the replies.  It's not such a hot topic with expats in France but by asking around and looking on the internet, she has understood something similar to both replies, either

1. she can only buy Class 2 for 6 years right now (to make it up to 30 years - something to do with COPE) and then she has to buy Class 3 for the remaining 5 years either as each year goes by, or all 5 years just before she retires in 2033, or

2. as she is under transitional rules she can buy the whole 11 years at class 2 now, or at least before 2025.

Due to working full time and the slight time difference, she has couldn't get through to the pensions helpline and although she wrote to them in October, she hasn't had a reply.

I was hoping by posting her exact forecast and situation, someone might be able to clarify things definitively.  

QrizB

HeparGirl24 said:

I was hoping by posting her exact forecast and situation, someone might be able to clarify things definitively. 

There are some folk on the forum who are able to do exactly that. I'm not one of them(!) but a couple of things don't quite add up.

HeparGirl24 said:

She wants to know if she should be trying to buy back some of her missing 11 years ...

Where does this "11 years" number come from?

A year adds £5.82 a week to your pension, up to a maximum of £203.85. If her current state pension forecast is £121.61, adding 11 years will only get her to £185.68. She needs to add 15 years (although 14 years will get her £203.15, with the 15th adding the last 70p.)

Dazed_and_C0nfused

QrizB said:

HeparGirl24 said:

I was hoping by posting her exact forecast and situation, someone might be able to clarify things definitively. 

There are some folk on the forum who are able to do exactly that. I'm not one of them(!) but a couple of things don't quite add up.

HeparGirl24 said:

She wants to know if she should be trying to buy back some of her missing 11 years ...

Where does this "11 years" number come from?

A year adds £5.82 a week to your pension, up to a maximum of £203.85. If her current state pension forecast is £121.61, adding 11 years will only get her to £185.68. She needs to add 15 years (although 14 years will get her £203.15, with the 15th adding the last 70p.)

I suspect the op is yet another who has somehow come to believe having 35 years is of some sort of relevance despite her sister clearly falling under the transitional rules

Although vague as to exactly which NI years are included this could possibly be 24 years?

1982 - 2005 all full qualifying years

molerat

£121.61 at Sep 22 is £133.89 today.

What is her total number of years currently held ?

On the face of it she needs another 12 years to reach a few pence below the max.

She comes under the old rules so can only use a maximum of 30 pre 2016 years.

Pre 2016 years will not add as much as post 2016 years, £5.21 v £5.82.

The more pre 2016 years bought will make the gap from the max larger, using the max available will mean 13 total required.

HeparGirl24

Her forecast says "you have 24 qualifying years" and that she can make it up to a maximum of £185.68. The letter is from 29 September 2022.

She has mistakenly assumed, or other expats have told her, it has to be made up to 35 years and that would give her a full pension. 

She asked me if this was true because I have recently looked into it for my partner and also because I have also lived and worked in France, but she is in a different situation again to either of us.  I wasn't at all sure as I have read the threads here but I said I would try to find out for her.

So, she now thinks the best way to increase her pension is to buy the years from 2016 - 2022 as soon as possible as she can pay Class 2 contributions, then buy years 2023 and 2024 at Class 2 when they become available, then from 2025 when she stops work she can buy years at Class 3.

Does this sound feasible or has she still got the wrong end of the stick?



  

Dazed_and_C0nfused

If she can buy 2016-17 and later years via Class 2 NI then that will definitely bump up her State Pension but if that will no longer be an option after 2024-25(?) then she will need to add another 3 years.  Probably 4 to reach the standard new State Pension but the fourth might only add pennies.

Is there any reason you aren't considering pre 2016-17 years?

If they are available via voluntary Class 2 then although they might not add quite as much as later years they are significantly cheaper then future Class 3 years will be.

HeparGirl24

Class 2 contributions are available to her while she is employed abroad, therefore potentially from 2006 to 2025. 

She is entitled to a small French pension so I don't think a few pennies short will make any difference.

Her friend made her enquire about it in the first place because she told her that if anything happened to her husband (ie death or divorce), neither her projected UK pension or her projected French pension, even combined, would be anywhere near enough to live on.

She is really looking for "insurance" so may well buy the pre 2016 years at Class 2 as that seems to be the best option.

She is very grateful for everybody's input by the way and thanks you all very much.

Dazed_and_C0nfused

Buying all available pre 2016 years is unlikely to be necessary.

She really needs to ascertain exactly which years will add value and can then buy the best ones factoring in cost and how much they will add to her existing accrued amount.