What the hell bailiff?

Jimmygg7

I've won a CCJ and the matter has been given to an HCEO.

He visited the defendant's alleged address but didn't find him there. He got his phone by the landlord.

He got in touch with the defendant who promised to pay up in one week's time, which of course he didn't.

I now got the below email from the bailiff.

Good Morning, 

Following on from the agents previous report, payment has not been made by the defendant. You will note that on this visit our Enforcement Agent has been unable to take control of goods or obtain payment from the defendant. Our agent has indicated that enforcement efforts may be exhausted and has therefore returned the matter for review. 

We will now review the file in office and liaise with the enforcement agent to determine the next course of action.

This review can take up to 30 days, please await our report.

We will not be answering any queries while this review is ongoing, any questions will be logged onto the account filed, and will not be answered until the review is completed.

So, they're claiming that they've exhausted all the options? Which is what, go to the address, and phone up the defendant and ask him to pay?

What sort of unilateral decision is this!?

What are my options here? It seems that even HCEO are pretty useless?

elsien

If they’re not going to accept any responses while they’re reviewing, I’m not sure you’ve got much option but to sit out the 30 days. I’d certainly expect more than one visit though before they gave up.

Jimmygg7

elsien said:

If they’re not going to accept any responses while they’re reviewing, I’m not sure you’ve got much option but to sit out the 30 days. I’d certainly expect more than one visit though before they gave up.

What's this "review process" anyway? I'm kept in the dark with regard to the whole process. This whole process has been going from "wait 2 weeks for the defendant to reply" to "wait up to 2 months for the writ to be sealed", to "wait 30 days" etc.

sourcrates

Unfortunately what you see on the telly is very carefully edited for transmission, they make the collection process look pretty easy and straightforward, when in reality, it is far from so, as people who allow them access are usually ignorant to the fact they are not obliged to do so.

A bailiff, even a HCEO, can be stopped in their tracks by a locked door, or a refusal to engage, or both frankly.
Unless the debtor allows the bailiff access to the property, they cannot take charge of goods, or obtain any payment from them, as they cannot force entry to private property, unless they are attending an eviction with a warrant that allows them to do so.

Unless the debtor cooperates with the bailiff, they are not going to get anywhere.

Usually they will attempt compliance up to three times, before handing the account back to the client, but it does depend on the circumstances, for example the debtor may not have any money, they may have issues which prevent them from engaging with the bailiff, or they may simply be ignoring them.

The review will involve doing a credit check on the debtor, checking social media, finding out if they own a car that`s not on finance, or property that they may own, stuff of that nature, you will have to wait for the outcome to find out.

fatbelly

This is fairly typical in the real world.

People watch the tv programs and think that's how it works rather than just being entertainment.

You've been unable to get payment from the debtor's assets - maybe he genuinely doesn't have any.

You can wait for the HCEO to conclude then try another method, like attachment to earnings, (charging order won't work unless he owns property), third party debt order or a statutory demand.

Jimmygg7

sourcrates said:

Unfortunately what you see on the telly is very carefully edited for transmission, they make the collection process look pretty easy and straightforward, when in reality, it is far from so, as people who allow them access are usually ignorant to the fact they are not obliged to do so.

A bailiff, even a HCEO, can be stopped in their tracks by a locked door, or a refusal to engage, or both frankly.
Unless the debtor allows the bailiff access to the property, they cannot take charge of goods, or obtain any payment from them, as they cannot force entry to private property, unless they are attending an eviction with a warrant that allows them to do so.

Unless the debtor cooperates with the bailiff, they are not going to get anywhere.

Usually they will attempt compliance up to three times, before handing the account back to the client, but it does depend on the circumstances, for example the debtor may not have any money, they may have issues which prevent them from engaging with the bailiff, or they may simply be ignoring them.

The review will involve doing a credit check on the debtor, checking social media, finding out if they own a car that`s not on finance, or property that they may own, stuff of that nature, you will have to wait for the outcome to find out.

Thanks for your explanation on the review process. For the record, I haven't seen any such programs ( I don't watch TV)

sourcrates

Jimmygg7 said:

sourcrates said:

Unfortunately what you see on the telly is very carefully edited for transmission, they make the collection process look pretty easy and straightforward, when in reality, it is far from so, as people who allow them access are usually ignorant to the fact they are not obliged to do so.

A bailiff, even a HCEO, can be stopped in their tracks by a locked door, or a refusal to engage, or both frankly.
Unless the debtor allows the bailiff access to the property, they cannot take charge of goods, or obtain any payment from them, as they cannot force entry to private property, unless they are attending an eviction with a warrant that allows them to do so.

Unless the debtor cooperates with the bailiff, they are not going to get anywhere.

Usually they will attempt compliance up to three times, before handing the account back to the client, but it does depend on the circumstances, for example the debtor may not have any money, they may have issues which prevent them from engaging with the bailiff, or they may simply be ignoring them.

The review will involve doing a credit check on the debtor, checking social media, finding out if they own a car that`s not on finance, or property that they may own, stuff of that nature, you will have to wait for the outcome to find out.

Thanks for your explanation on the review process. For the record, I haven't seen any such programs ( I don't watch TV)

That`s fair enough, however that is where most people see bailiffs in action, and assume, wrongly, that engaging them is always 100% successful, when really it isn`t.

If this route doesn't work for you, fatbelly outlines the alternatives in his post above.

Good luck getting this resolved.

Jimmygg7

Update on this, a few months later...

I've submitted an order to obtain information but the defendant didn't show up (I did go to the court).

The staff told me that the case would now go back to a judge to re-assess.

From my understanding, when someone doesn't attend court for questioning, he can face up to imprisonment. But so can he, if he passes with a red light!

I still haven't heard back from the court 2 weeks later. What's likely to happen from now on?

fatbelly

I believe the penalty is 14 days imprisonment, but I've never known it to be applied. Probably the court bailiff will be instructed to personally deliver a notice with a new date for the interview. 

There isn't a lot of point you attending. The debtor just has to complete a form with a court employee. Then they send you a copy

Jimmygg7

fatbelly said:

I believe the penalty is 14 days imprisonment, but I've never known it to be applied.

I thought that this would be one of the "mental harassment" the order to obtain information would cause him, but once again, I'm sad to say that it looks like the judicial system is quite weak.

I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens.

fatbelly said:

There isn't a lot of point you attending.

I thought it would show up just to "do my part" if it goes back to a judge, to say that I was interested and attended.

MattMattMattUK

Is the person you are trying to get money from employed? If so an attachment to earnings would be the best way to go.