PayPal negative balance and Moorcroft

hameed92

I was wondering if someone can advice me regarding the incident below or if someone has had a similar experience.

Earlier in the year I was using PayPal to top up balance in my forex trading account. I was unaware that I had a trade running which was in drawdown and used Paypal to top up my trading account. When I checked my trading account, I couldn’t see the updated balance (a mistake on my part as it had cleared the drawdown) and I assumed the payment hadn’t gone through so used Paypal to top up again. This amounted to 20k. 
However, the payment was rejected by my bank due to insufficient funds in my bank account. Despite this, PayPal removed the funds from my bank account on the same day and transferred this to my trading account. Several calls to my bank, they charged back the amount and the negative balance on my bank account was cleared but then it appeared on Paypal. Paypal did their investigation and said the payment was legitimate as I had approved it and the negative balance (20k) now reflects in my Paypal account.  

I strongly believe that this action by PayPal is a breach of their terms and conditions. While I understand that PayPal has the right to make the payment, I think it is unreasonable for them to remove money from your bank account that you don’t actually have. They should reject this just like a bank does so you do not go into a negative balance or overdraft. 

2 months have passed and I had several emails from Paypal regarding the clearing the overdrawn amount. I was initially going to make the payment and clear the balance, however reading a few posts on here and other forums, I saw other people have had similar issues and no one has ever been pursued or taken to court regarding this. Interestingly, Paypal don’t have the legal right to pursue someone regarding an outstanding negative balance in UK. 

I have now started being contacted by Moorcroft, the debt collection agency that Paypal use. They’ve been calling me and sending me letters however no visits to the property. The property they have registered for me is also a property I don’t reside at anymore. I have been ignoring these so far. 

My question is can Moorcroft take me to court on behalf of Paypal? Has this happened before or do they have the legal right to do this in UK? How long will they harass me for?  Has anyone else been in a similar position that can share their experience.

Any help or guidance will be appreciated. TIA.

PartyOfFive

So... you're basically asking if you can rip-off paypal to the tune of 20k?

fatbelly

I can't completely follow what happened with Paypal but I can answer your questions.

Moorcroft cannot start a court claim as they do not own the debt - they are merely acting as collection agents.

They will work through their standard letters. This should take around 3 months. Then they will hand the account back.

marcia_

hameed92 said:

I was wondering if someone can advice me regarding the incident below or if someone has had a similar experience.

Earlier in the year I was using PayPal to top up balance in my forex trading account. I was unaware that I had a trade running which was in drawdown and used Paypal to top up my trading account. When I checked my trading account, I couldn’t see the updated balance (a mistake on my part as it had cleared the drawdown) and I assumed the payment hadn’t gone through so used Paypal to top up again. This amounted to 20k. 
However, the payment was rejected by my bank due to insufficient funds in my bank account. Despite this, PayPal removed the funds from my bank account on the same day and transferred this to my trading account. Several calls to my bank, they charged back the amount and the negative balance on my bank account was cleared but then it appeared on Paypal. Paypal did their investigation and said the payment was legitimate as I had approved it and the negative balance (20k) now reflects in my Paypal account.  

I strongly believe that this action by PayPal is a breach of their terms and conditions. While I understand that PayPal has the right to make the payment, I think it is unreasonable for them to remove money from your bank account that you don’t actually have. They should reject this just like a bank does so you do not go into a negative balance or overdraft. 

2 months have passed and I had several emails from Paypal regarding the clearing the overdrawn amount. I was initially going to make the payment and clear the balance, however reading a few posts on here and other forums, I saw other people have had similar issues and no one has ever been pursued or taken to court regarding this. Interestingly, Paypal don’t have the legal right to pursue someone regarding an outstanding negative balance in UK. 

I have now started being contacted by Moorcraft, the debt collection agency that Paypal use. They’ve been calling me and sending me letters however no visits to the property. The property they have registered for me is also a property I don’t reside at anymore. I have been ignoring these so far. 

My question is can Moorcraft take me to court on behalf of Paypal? Has this happened before or do they have the legal right to do this in UK? How long will they harass me for?  Has anyone else been in a similar position that can share their experience.

Any help or guidance will be appreciated. TIA.

 Who told you that? Any company can lodge a Court claim against you. 

 Given PayPal are not known to chase small amounts but i can see them taking you to a court for this. 

hameed92

PartyOfFive said:

So... you're basically asking if you can rip-off paypal to the tune of 20k?

Not really however I don't think money should be taken out or paid if it is not actually there to protect against these very issues. Dont mind paying as I already mentioned, I've just held off incase it will actually not be pursued 

hameed92

marcia_ said:

hameed92 said:

I was wondering if someone can advice me regarding the incident below or if someone has had a similar experience.

Earlier in the year I was using PayPal to top up balance in my forex trading account. I was unaware that I had a trade running which was in drawdown and used Paypal to top up my trading account. When I checked my trading account, I couldn’t see the updated balance (a mistake on my part as it had cleared the drawdown) and I assumed the payment hadn’t gone through so used Paypal to top up again. This amounted to 20k. 
However, the payment was rejected by my bank due to insufficient funds in my bank account. Despite this, PayPal removed the funds from my bank account on the same day and transferred this to my trading account. Several calls to my bank, they charged back the amount and the negative balance on my bank account was cleared but then it appeared on Paypal. Paypal did their investigation and said the payment was legitimate as I had approved it and the negative balance (20k) now reflects in my Paypal account.  

I strongly believe that this action by PayPal is a breach of their terms and conditions. While I understand that PayPal has the right to make the payment, I think it is unreasonable for them to remove money from your bank account that you don’t actually have. They should reject this just like a bank does so you do not go into a negative balance or overdraft. 

2 months have passed and I had several emails from Paypal regarding the clearing the overdrawn amount. I was initially going to make the payment and clear the balance, however reading a few posts on here and other forums, I saw other people have had similar issues and no one has ever been pursued or taken to court regarding this. Interestingly, Paypal don’t have the legal right to pursue someone regarding an outstanding negative balance in UK. 

I have now started being contacted by Moorcraft, the debt collection agency that Paypal use. They’ve been calling me and sending me letters however no visits to the property. The property they have registered for me is also a property I don’t reside at anymore. I have been ignoring these so far. 

My question is can Moorcraft take me to court on behalf of Paypal? Has this happened before or do they have the legal right to do this in UK? How long will they harass me for?  Has anyone else been in a similar position that can share their experience.

Any help or guidance will be appreciated. TIA.

 Who told you that? Any company can lodge a Court claim against you. 

 Given PayPal are not known to chase small amounts but i can see them taking you to a court for this. 

Internet is full of moorcraft or PayPal not having a legal right to take anyone to court, I've seen forums where people owe thousands however nothing happened. 
Regardless, receiving calls and emails from a debt collection agency can make anyone a little anxious 😬

Floss

hameed92 said:

PartyOfFive said:

So... you're basically asking if you can rip-off paypal to the tune of 20k?

Not really however I don't think money should be taken out or paid if it is not actually there to protect against these very issues. Dont mind paying as I already mentioned, I've just held off incase it will actually not be pursued 

Most creditors would probably pursue a debt of £20k, regardless of what those forums you have seen say.

marcia_

 I wouldn't believe everything you read. Any company, even overseas companies, can lodge a Court claim against you. 20k is no small amount and worth them spending money chasing 

sourcrates

marcia_ said:

 I wouldn't believe everything you read. Any company, even overseas companies, can lodge a Court claim against you. 20k is no small amount and worth them spending money chasing 

PayPal appear to be unique in this respect, of all bad debts chased by debt collection agencies, on behalf of PayPal, who incidentally are -

• Wescot Credit Services
• Akinika
• Moorcroft

to my knowledge, not one has ever gone to court.

What they may do instead, especially for 20k, is sell the debt to the likes of Lowell or Cabot, Arrow Global or similar, who will then chase you for it, and legal action is a real prospect if you ignore these companies for any length of time.

hameed92

sourcrates said:

marcia_ said:

 I wouldn't believe everything you read. Any company, even overseas companies, can lodge a Court claim against you. 20k is no small amount and worth them spending money chasing 

PayPal appear to be unique in this respect, of all bad debts chased by debt collection agencies, on behalf of PayPal, who incidentally are -

• Wescot Credit Services
• Akinika
• Moorcroft

to my knowledge, not one has ever gone to court.

What they may do instead, especially for 20k, is sell the debt to the likes of Lowell or Cabot, Arrow Global or similar, who will then chase you for it, and legal action is a real prospect if you ignore these companies for any length of time.

Paypal will sell it to these companies or moorcraft will? I have already been contacted by moorcraft( to my knowledge they only collect the debt rather than buy off paypal) however if I understand you correctly they may sell the debt onto the alternative companies? 

WhiskersTheWonderCat

hameed92 said:

I think it is unreasonable for them to remove money from your bank account that you don’t actually have. 

How exactly are Paypal to know you don't have the funds available in your bank? They don't have access to that information. You requested that they take the money from your account, and they did. But supposedly that's Paypal's fault. 

Even IF it was Paypal's fault, you think that they should be punished to the tune of £20K?! Seriously? What losses have you actually incurred?