Zappi & Harvi Price

DN8

Morning

What should I be expecting to pay for a zappi & Harvi to be installed?

Also what does the Harvi part do,, really impressed with my solar installation this march, but on good days I can be exporting over 30kwh, not so bad on flux. But on quick calculations I think that I could almost have free fuel all year with my excess spring, summer & autumn solar payments

JKenH

DN8 said:

Morning

What should I be expecting to pay for a zappi & Harvi to be installed?

Also what does the Harvi part do,, really impressed with my solar installation this march, but on good days I can be exporting over 30kwh, not so bad on flux. But on quick calculations I think that I could almost have free fuel all year with my excess spring, summer & autumn solar payments

I can’t give you a current price for installation but would caution payback of the extra cost of a Zappi may take a while so bear that in mind if there is a premium to pay over a more basic charger.

Over 2 years and 9 months of regular use my Zappi imported 2850 kWh from the grid and supplied 1482 from my solar panels. At the time that solar was displacing Octopus Go Faster charging at 5.5p/kWh and so saved me £81.51 - in theory. Usually I ran it on Eco setting during the day where it draws a minimum 1.4 kW irrespective of rather than on Eco+ which only charges when there is more than 1.4kW available from the panels. Why use Eco you might ask as when a cloud passes over you draw some power from the grid? I would do so when I worked out on balance it was still cheaper overall to take some grid draw (e.g. 500 watts) at 13.3p/kWh then  charge overnight at 5.5p. Had I just used Eco+ then the Zappi would have been cycling on and off all the time on an intermittently sunny/cloudy day, slightly out of sync with the sunshine. Also I would have missed out on a lot of sunshine when for instance there was only 1.2 kW available. The result is though that the real saving is less than £81. 

A second point to bear in mind is that charging is less efficient at lower power so you are not getting as much value out of the solar you put into the car. It may be more efficient to charge at 7kW than say 2kW. 

The most important point to consider, though, is by using your solar generation to charge your car you are forgoing the 22p or at times even 35p/kWh export you can earn by exporting your solar. If you can get by with 3 hours a night of cheap rate charging (maybe adding 60 miles of range) on the 19p cheap Flux rate then any charging from your own solar is best avoided. 

Flux changes the whole way we think about using our own solar generation and in some situations (not all) can be more worthwhile for EV owners with solar (and batteries) than using a dedicated EV TOU tariff. 

Screwdriva

These days, £1500 installed for a Zappi. In my humble view, the Myenergi integrated device ecosystem (Zappi + Eddi + Libbi) is the most future-roof solution on the market. 

Do any of them make financial sense when considering return on financial investment for a typical household on the Flux tariff? Not likely. But they may one day. 

Petriix

With SEG payments as high as they are, any solar self consumption has to be weighed up against the lost income. It's quite different from the calculation for those of us on deemed exports under the old FIT scheme.

The Harvi is only required where the CT clamps can't practically be wired into the Zappi (or if you need more than 3). They cost about £50 so shouldn't add greatly to the bill.

I like my Zappi but, if I was installing an EVSE today, I'd go for something immediately compatible with Octopus Intelligent - so OHME or Hypervolt. Zappi is in the pipeline apparently but I wouldn't hold my breath. 

Exiled_Tyke

My Zappi (fitted four months ago) cost exactly the same as my friend's PodPoint fitted one month ago. (although an every so slightly more complicated install).  Obviously this is not an fair comparison (and I can't be bothered looking up list prices etc.) but I'm wondering if there is such a great difference in price to get to a payback position? 

For me I'm staying with my FIT deemed export (I don't want the hassle, MCS, DNO stuff etc..) to worry about in changing over to SEG and with a house battery I already use greater than the deemed self-consumption of 50%.  I'm at home quite a lot during the day so charging from excess solar is quite viable.    Eco+ now allows the user to set a maximum grid import rate so I have set to ensure one unit of total charge doesn't cost me more than one unit of overnight electricity.  For me the cut off is around 20% import to 80% solar. So this smoothens some of the start/stop of charging with intermittent sun (as we had last weekend).

I saved one whole pound of electricty (at nighttime rate) this last weekend. It would have been more but  I needed to get a lot of washing and dishwasher loads done while the weather was relatively good and the sun was quite intermittent at times.  All in all I'm very happy with that and don't regret my choice at all. (And oh the fun of seeing the sun come out and Zappi switching from 'waiting for surplus' to 'charging'.

DN8

I have thought about the income forgone by not exporting as much through flux.  But with 9.84KWp installed I am producing far more than I consume for a lot of the year

Also doing the numbers, if I do the majority of charging at home (even at the 32p rate & not even using solar) then an EV would still cost less our current diesel in fuel/mile.  

JKenH

DN8 said:

I have thought about the income forgone by not exporting as much through flux.  But with 9.84KWp installed I am producing far more than I consume for a lot of the year

Also doing the numbers, if I do the majority of charging at home (even at the 32p rate & not even using solar) then an EV would still cost less our current diesel in fuel/mile.  

Are you already on Flux? I thought there was a 9kWp limit on system size but I may be wrong. 

A lot depends on how you see electricity and diesel prices going. If diesel drops in price I suspect the  chancellor will introduce the several times postponed rise in fuel duty. I think most people are expecting electricity prices to come down as well. Unfortunately markets never react the way people expect them to because usually some new crisis comes along and upsets the apple cart.

I was thinking of getting another electric car now used prices have dropped (too far maybe) but Flux has made me think again. I pay around 12p/mile for petrol and (depending on the EV) it would maybe cost me around 6p/mile charging mainly on a mix of 19p import and 22p/kWh foregone export. The problem with any newish car is that depreciation rather than fuel is usually the biggest cost. Will a diesel hold its value as well as an EV?

DN8

JKenH said:

DN8 said:

I have thought about the income forgone by not exporting as much through flux.  But with 9.84KWp installed I am producing far more than I consume for a lot of the year

Also doing the numbers, if I do the majority of charging at home (even at the 32p rate & not even using solar) then an EV would still cost less our current diesel in fuel/mile.  

Are you already on Flux? I thought there was a 9kWp limit on system size but I may be wrong. 

A lot depends on how you see electricity and diesel prices going. If diesel drops in price I suspect the  chancellor will introduce the several times postponed rise in fuel duty. I think most people are expecting electricity prices to come down as well. Unfortunately markets never react the way people expect them to because usually some new crisis comes along and upsets the apple cart.

I was thinking of getting another electric car now used prices have dropped (too far maybe) but Flux has made me think again. I pay around 12p/mile for petrol and (depending on the EV) it would maybe cost me around 6p/mile charging mainly on a mix of 19p import and 22p/kWh foregone export. The problem with any newish car is that depreciation rather than fuel is usually the biggest cost. Will a diesel hold its value as well as an EV?

It appears that they have dropped the 9kwp maximum 🤷‍♂️

Or I got lucky 

Alnat1

Is it just me that thinks this thread title sounds like a set of twins who are gonna turn up on Love Island next year?