Paid for an oven installation that didn't happen, options ?

eci22

Hi All,
I bought a new integrated microwave/grill combi along with my old oven removal/recycle (£20), new oven installation (£110) and 5 year protection plan(£70) from a firm called beacon electrical the appliance is made by Indesit which is a hotpoint/whirlpool derivative.

Yesterday the installers arrived and said they were unable to perform the install because of an electrical issue, the oven and hob are wired from the same socket and it would draw too much power. The installer said it's a simple job for an electrician to fix a socket or a fused spur and wire in the new oven and advised I should call the company I bought from for a refund as they did not do the install they also forgot to remove the old appliance. The installer said this is a job they are unable to do.

I called the company and was quite concerned with the tone I got from the rep, he said they'll investigate why the install couldn't take place a process that he said should take 14 to 21 days and they'll let me know how much I'm entitled to get back which worried me because I expect to get back 100% as no attempt was made for the service I payed for.

My other concern is that length of time puts me outside my statutory rights period.

I was wondering what my legal rights are as a consumer in this scenario or any other advise to ensure I am refunded in full.

Thank you

tightauldgit

I'd have a good look through the terms of the installation contract - there may well be something that says that if an installation cannot be carried out because of issues with the customer's setup then that's the customer's responsibility. Clearly an attempt was made - they turned up ready to the work but were unable to due to the circumstances of the job. 

So the two open questions are - were the workmen right to refuse to perform the install? and, if they were is that your responsibility as a customer to ensure that your kitchen is suitable for the equipment to be installed. 

I suspect that if the workmen were correct in what they say then your legal rights are probably limited. 

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Their website says they'll refund 50% for a failed install for the following reasons:

• Supply connections are not accessible or of suitable condition to make a safe and proper installation.
• Alterations to cabinetry or structure is required in order to complete the installation.
• Other products need to be moved or removed in order to allow the installation of this appliance - this must be done prior to our team arrive on site.
• As time is allocated to our delivery teams if an installation is cancelled on the day of your booked delivery slot.

I assume you ordered on their website, if so what did they tell you about your right to cancel the service?

TELLIT01

An electrician attended and couldn't do the work because of one of the problems listed.  They need to be paid and there is no reason the appliance retailer should take the hit.  What happened to the new oven, was that left with you or taken away again?  Is the old oven still in place?  It may be that they only remove the old oven when the new one is installed.

Alderbank

eci22 said:

My other concern is that length of time puts me outside my statutory rights period.

I was wondering what my legal rights are as a consumer in this scenario or any other advise to ensure I am refunded in full.

What exactly is your concern?

Broadly speaking, your statutory rights exist as long as you own the goods although they do change and diminish over time.

Are you now considering rejecting the new combi oven?

ThumbRemote

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

• Supply connections are not accessible or of suitable condition to make a safe and proper installation.

Unless they specify what is required of the supply connection in advance this is a meaningless term. The OP is not an electrician, they have no way of knowing what fitting is required. As both retailer and installer, Beacon Electrical should have stated what was required. 

km1500

it is exactly the same for eg a washing machine. They will.install as long as there is suitable water supply, drainage etc. Otherwise not

You have an unsuitable power source. Pay an electrician to correct the situation.

tightauldgit

ThumbRemote said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

• Supply connections are not accessible or of suitable condition to make a safe and proper installation.

Unless they specify what is required of the supply connection in advance this is a meaningless term. The OP is not an electrician, they have no way of knowing what fitting is required. As both retailer and installer, Beacon Electrical should have stated what was required. 

No doubt the technical specs of the product would be on the website somewhere  showing what was required but possibly not. I think there definitely is an argument that the customer couldn't be expected to know but then again neither could the installer know if the customer has a suitable setup until they arrive. 

If it was something non-standard I'd probably expect to be made aware of it 

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

ThumbRemote said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

• Supply connections are not accessible or of suitable condition to make a safe and proper installation.

Unless they specify what is required of the supply connection in advance this is a meaningless term. The OP is not an electrician, they have no way of knowing what fitting is required. As both retailer and installer, Beacon Electrical should have stated what was required. 

This was my initial feeling, AO have some instructions on their install page:

https://ao.com/help-and-advice/delivery-and-services/installation/electric-oven

Where as the place OP purchased from has less info:

https://www.beaconelectrical.co.uk/installation/

It does say 

reserve the right to refuse installation should they think that the existing electrical points are unsafe and in need of maintenance. 

which is open to interpretation, to me unsafe means failing rather than not meeting the requirements of the appliance, although wiring it up to an unsuitable system would be unsafe, the state of the wiring wasn't unsafe beforehand, simply insufficient if you see what I mean.  

Their website only mentions the right to cancel the contract for goods (unless I'm missing it as usual), if they didn't tell OP they have the right to cancel the service as well OP would be entitled to and not have to pay anything for any aspect of the service the company may happen to deem was carried out (assuming distance/off premises contract). 

eci22

Thank you all for your replies,

tightauldgit said:

I'd have a good look through the terms of the installation contract - there may well be something that says that if an installation cannot be carried out because of issues with the customer's setup then that's the customer's responsibility. Clearly an attempt was made - they turned up ready to the work but were unable to due to the circumstances of the job. 

So the two open questions are - were the workmen right to refuse to perform the install? and, if they were is that your responsibility as a customer to ensure that your kitchen is suitable for the equipment to be installed. 

I suspect that if the workmen were correct in what they say then your legal rights are probably limited. 

Yes I'll take a thorough look at the T&Cs that's a great point, I don't know if they were right or wrong but to me if they decide not to install is it right that I'm still charged for an installation and a removal that was never actually done, he literally looked at it and said 'nope' and left.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Their website says they'll refund 50% for a failed install for the following reasons:

• Supply connections are not accessible or of suitable condition to make a safe and proper installation.
• Alterations to cabinetry or structure is required in order to complete the installation.
• Other products need to be moved or removed in order to allow the installation of this appliance - this must be done prior to our team arrive on site.
• As time is allocated to our delivery teams if an installation is cancelled on the day of your booked delivery slot.

I assume you ordered on their website, if so what did they tell you about your right to cancel the service?

Ordered over the phone after confirming details about the product (which turned out they gave me the wrong info i.e. hardwired vs plugged) nothing was mentioned on the phone and nothing on the invoice.

TELLIT01 said:

An electrician attended and couldn't do the work because of one of the problems listed.  They need to be paid and there is no reason the appliance retailer should take the hit.  What happened to the new oven, was that left with you or taken away again?  Is the old oven still in place?  It may be that they only remove the old oven when the new one is installed.

Yes they left the old one in place and the new one in the living room, I'm not sure he was an electrician because he said I needed an electrician to fit a new socket that is independent of the hob. They came from hotpoint not from the retailer themselves.

Alderbank said:

eci22 said:

My other concern is that length of time puts me outside my statutory rights period.

I was wondering what my legal rights are as a consumer in this scenario or any other advise to ensure I am refunded in full.

What exactly is your concern?

Broadly speaking, your statutory rights exist as long as you own the goods although they do change and diminish over time.

Are you now considering rejecting the new combi oven?

My concern is if they didn't install and didn't remove the old appliance, these services I paid extra for, should I not be entitled to a refund for those services ?

No I'm not rejecting the new oven I'm having an electrician sort it out-effectively I've paid twice for an installation

km1500 said:

it is exactly the same for eg a washing machine. They will.install as long as there is suitable water supply, drainage etc. Otherwise not

You have an unsuitable power source. Pay an electrician to correct the situation.

Yes that's what I've done. But I want to know if there's anything consumer rights wise for a refund on  a service that they didn't actually do.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

ThumbRemote said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

• Supply connections are not accessible or of suitable condition to make a safe and proper installation.

Unless they specify what is required of the supply connection in advance this is a meaningless term. The OP is not an electrician, they have no way of knowing what fitting is required. As both retailer and installer, Beacon Electrical should have stated what was required. 

This was my initial feeling, AO have some instructions on their install page:

https://ao.com/help-and-advice/delivery-and-services/installation/electric-oven

Where as the place OP purchased from has less info:

https://www.beaconelectrical.co.uk/installation/

It does say 

reserve the right to refuse installation should they think that the existing electrical points are unsafe and in need of maintenance. 

which is open to interpretation, to me unsafe means failing rather than not meeting the requirements of the appliance, although wiring it up to an unsuitable system would be unsafe, the state of the wiring wasn't unsafe beforehand, simply insufficient if you see what I mean.  

Their website only mentions the right to cancel the contract for goods (unless I'm missing it as usual), if they didn't tell OP they have the right to cancel the service as well OP would be entitled to and not have to pay anything for any aspect of the service the company may happen to deem was carried out (assuming distance/off premises contract). 

 My issue isn't that they refused the install, my issue is if they refused the install should I still be charged ? infact he was really nice about it, he said call the company and they'll refund the installation charge, but I'm getting the feeling they wont do that- its been nearly a week and I've not heard anything back from them

Thank you all for your help! very much appreciated

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

eci22 said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

I assume you ordered on their website, if so what did they tell you about your right to cancel the service?

Ordered over the phone after confirming details about the product (which turned out they gave me the wrong info i.e. hardwired vs plugged) nothing was mentioned on the phone and nothing on the invoice.

I would only recommend it as a last resort but you are entitled to cancel the service and if the trader didn't inform you of your right to cancel the service (worth checking an emails they sent and all paperwork) you aren't obligated to pay for any aspect of the service they may claim you received. 

I would see what they come back with, at worst you can point them to their website where they say they'll give a 50% refund (don't be shy to pester them if they aren't getting back to you ) and beyond that there is a letter before action and then small claims but if you do get 50% back, as frustrating as it might be, it might not be worth the headache for the remaining £55