How do you guys keep track of ROI on your panels / battery?

paul991

It  gets very awkward to compare like for like useage and therefore energy saving  ,When getting pv I became more aware of energy use and  have used the FIT payments to make improvments to insulation ect  

70sbudgie

When I installed my PV, I was lucky enough to have the money in the bank. So my "business case" wasn't based on financial ROI (16 years), it was based on an annual return (~6.5%). 

My calculation based on actual generation is very simple - generation and export. I assume the difference is self consumption and apply the day rate to it and then add income from export. First year I was on track for ~6%. I haven't done my second year's calculation yet, but believe it will be much better.

When we extended / replaced our kitchen, we also looked at the costs of alternatives (like moving house). We came to the conclusion that we wouldn't get our money back, but the ROI was a non financial one, in that it would significantly improve our quality of living. I believe that has also exceeded expectations.

EricMears

70sbudgie said:

When I installed my PV, I was lucky enough to have the money in the bank. So my "business case" wasn't based on financial ROI (16 years), it was based on an annual return (~6.5%). 

My calculation based on actual generation is very simple - generation and export. I assume the difference is self consumption and apply the day rate to it and then add income from export. First year I was on track for ~6%. I haven't done my second year's calculation yet, but believe it will be much better.

When we extended / replaced our kitchen, we also looked at the costs of alternatives (like moving house). We came to the conclusion that we wouldn't get our money back, but the ROI was a non financial one, in that it would significantly improve our quality of living. I believe that has also exceeded expectations.

Ours was also a cash purchase but FIT scheme suggested >12% annual earnings.   It's been even better than that : initial outlay recovered after 7 years and presently earning something approaching 20% pa  of original investment.

silverwhistle

I've never been a smoker, but I've lost the post-it note with my calculations..

Another cash purchase here back in 2013, with my rainy day funds which were languishing doing nothing in a cash ISA, so I didn't undertake too rigorous a CBA. Probably paid for in about 7 years, but it's difficult to ascribe a value to certain aspects. What value should one put on the units used for heating water, can you ascribe a value for less maintenance needed for the gas boiler? Does the change to mindset have a value?

Perhaps peace of mind also has a value: I haven't been too worried by the current fuel price crisis on a personal basis.

In the meantime by bathroom is looking increasingly tatty and I've no idea how to work out the ROI for that..

70sbudgie

silverwhistle said:

Perhaps peace of mind also has a value: I haven't been too worried by the current fuel price crisis on a personal basis.

In the meantime by bathroom is looking increasingly tatty and I've no idea how to work out the ROI for that..

I use time to clean and then turn that into a monetary value if I'm pushed for costs. But I hate household chores, so the ROI on having rooms that are easy to clean has a much higher value to me than £/hr.

My calc was based on SEG only as my install was after FITs had ended.  (Sorry for the quotes being a bit squiffy)

EricMears said:

70sbudgie said:

When I installed my PV, I was lucky enough to have the money in the bank. So my "business case" wasn't based on financial ROI (16 years), it was based on an annual return (~6.5%). 

My calculation based on actual generation is very simple - generation and export. I assume the difference is self consumption and apply the day rate to it and then add income from export. First year I was on track for ~6%. I haven't done my second year's calculation yet, but believe it will be much better.

When we extended / replaced our kitchen, we also looked at the costs of alternatives (like moving house). We came to the conclusion that we wouldn't get our money back, but the ROI was a non financial one, in that it would significantly improve our quality of living. I believe that has also exceeded expectations.

Ours was also a cash purchase but FIT scheme suggested >12% annual earnings.   It's been even better than that : initial outlay recovered after 7 years and presently earning something approaching 20% pa  of original investment.

Mikeyboy01443

To me there are two types of people who look at solar - bean counters, and those who just do it....
I have seen people on here and elsewhere give reasons not to install such as it would take longer to pay off than the warranty of the items lasts... or solar panels are only x% efficient so they are waiting for better tech to come along... to me such thinking is ridiculous, as others have mentioned, the same "how long will that take to pay for itself " argument is not presented for every large cost purchase, only solar it seems, as if it is some new technology which has to pay for itself or it isnt worth getting. 
For me i just wanted solar to reduce my bills as a high electricity user (EV, A/C etc), the fact it may pay for itself at some point was a plus but at no point before installing did i bother working out howc long it will take to pay off.
I now log it in a spreadsheet so i can see. As others have said it is quite hard to quantify, but i measure by export, and also i look at what my house used each month and times that by the standard rate, as without solar, I would have used that amount of electricity, so each month the amount i (would have) spent + export is what i pay off the total...

flyinggoose

EcoScruples said:

I refuse to believe anyone doesn't buy solar for ROI. When people say that, then what they're saying is they bought solar to lose money. That makes no sense what so ever.
By reducing your energy bills you will make a return eventually, how long is the interesting bit for many people.
What I do believe is that some aren't bothered by how long it takes to payback.

My spreadsheet is a bit simpler than Rogues, nice work.

Exactly, someone mentioned about how people don't expect ROI from a kitchen purchase so why solar? This type of comparison makes no sense, no one installs a new kitchen expecting financial gain in the long run, whereas with Solar they do, if you don't care about ROI good for you, but for the rest of us its the opposite.

70sbudgie

I think the general idea is that the return on a financial investment isn't always financial - it can be other things that are much harder to quantify - comfort, security, peace of mind, independence...

EcoScruples

Very true, other gains are apparent with many things.
With Solar you buy to reduce your energy bill, that's the core reason, which means to buy and not have it pay for itself is ludicrous, hence ROI is what people are doing even if they think they are not.
It has no functional use apart from reduc I ng energy. Onsumption from the grid.
Unlike kitchens, cars etc which have other main purposes.

70sbudgie

Reducing energy consumption from the grid is increasing energy independence. If set up with the ability for islanding, batteries and solar are increasing energy security. 

Installing domestic PV is actively increasing the amount of renewable generation in the UK (this is a big driver for Ripple projects).

So there are other, non financial reasons for installing PV.

I have had a conversation with someone (not here), where they had avoided installing PV as part of their eco mission because they felt it took away support from their green supplier.