State Pension and Self Assessment

jem16

jimmo said:

frugalmacdugal said:

Hi,

I'm confused, how do you get a 53 week year, 1st Jan to 31 Dec or tax year 6th April to 5th April?

Each person's State Pension payday is determined by their NI number.When is the state pension paid? - Saga

 As 6 April was Thursday this year roughly one fifth of pensioners will be entitled to 53 weeks pension.

Yep that's me. Payment day is a Thursday and so first payment was Thursday 6th April 2023.

jem16

jimmo said:

jem16 said:

xylophone said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9zOPUq87zU

Following that guidance it only mentions 52 weeks. How odd as you wouldn’t think HMRC would happily forego the tax on the extra week. 

Still leaves me filling in a SA with information on 52 weeks that I know isn’t correct. 

HMRC obtain their State Pension date from DWP and in 10 years of being a pensioner not once have I been able to reconcile the figures used in my Coding with my own reckoning. Its never out by much but it is always out.

I can actually reconcile the figure used in my coding as it's 51 weeks of new rate plus one week of old rate. Only the pence has been dropped from the figure used in my tax code but I would expect that anyway.

Dazed_and_C0nfused

jem16 said:

jimmo said:

jem16 said:

xylophone said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9zOPUq87zU

Following that guidance it only mentions 52 weeks. How odd as you wouldn’t think HMRC would happily forego the tax on the extra week. 

Still leaves me filling in a SA with information on 52 weeks that I know isn’t correct. 

HMRC obtain their State Pension date from DWP and in 10 years of being a pensioner not once have I been able to reconcile the figures used in my Coding with my own reckoning. Its never out by much but it is always out.

I can actually reconcile the figure used in my coding as it's 51 weeks of new rate plus one week of old rate. Only the pence has been dropped from the figure used in my tax code but I would expect that anyway.

And that is going to be fine for Self Assessment.

I suspect HMRC have bigger fish to fry.

dales1

My own tax code (at the start of every year) uses 51 x new rate plus 1 x old week's pension. (And precisely so).

My own online self-assessment form (at the end of every year) is always pre-populated with 52 x new rate, precisely.

The HMRC form says "Please select 'No' if this figure is not correct. You can then amend the figure and give an explanation as to why the figure is different from the one HMRC quoted".

It seems HMRC are not expecting it to be amended, and are deterring people from touching it.

So even though their figures are slightly wrong on the high side, people may be loath to correct them and stick their heads above the parapet.

Grrr !

Dazed_and_C0nfused

dales1 said:

My own tax code (at the start of every year) uses 51 x new rate plus 1 x old week's pension. (And precisely so).

My own online self-assessment form (at the end of every year) is always pre-populated with 52 x new rate, precisely.

The HMRC form says "Please select 'No' if this figure is not correct. You can then amend the figure and give an explanation as to why the figure is different from the one HMRC quoted".

It seems HMRC are not expecting it to be amended, and are deterring people from touching it.

So even though their figures are slightly wrong on the high side, people may be loath to correct them and stick their heads above the parapet.

Grrr !

Not sure those two really tie up.

Why include the information on how to change it if they were trying to deter people from changing it.

Maybe the question is why isn't the pre-populated with the 1+51 like the tax code deduction is?

dales1

Thanks muchly, Dazed.

The HMRC Notes to this cell on the form say that (inter alia) "The figure of taxable State Pension has been provided by the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP). The figure displayed is your annual entitlement for the tax year".

So people will be reluctant to alter it, unless they can "give an explanation as to why the figure is different from the one HMRC quoted", as they being are obligated to do.

For myself, I cannot give them an explanation, except to observe that their supposed DWP figures for that year are correct in my tax code and wrong in the pre-populated return.

So I am reluctant to amend it (even though HMRC are wrong every year).

And yes exactly, "the question is why isn't the form pre-populated with the 1+51 like the tax code deduction is?".

Especially when it affects (and confuses) probably millions of senile old folk with their tax returns.

jem16

dales1 said:

For myself, I cannot give them an explanation, except to observe that their supposed DWP figures for that year are correct in my tax code and wrong in the pre-populated return.

So I am reluctant to amend it (even though HMRC are wrong every year).

Tax year 2022/23 will be my first tax return with the state pension. I notice that it hasn’t been pre-populated but that may simply be because it’s the first year and only a part year. 

As to changing the amount of it shows 52 weeks of the new rate, then I would be changing it with the explanation that I received one week at the old rate and 51 weeks of the new rate. 

[Deleted User]

jem16 said:

dales1 said:

For myself, I cannot give them an explanation, except to observe that their supposed DWP figures for that year are correct in my tax code and wrong in the pre-populated return.

So I am reluctant to amend it (even though HMRC are wrong every year).

Tax year 2022/23 will be my first tax return with the state pension. I notice that it hasn’t been pre-populated but that may simply be because it’s the first year and only a part year. 

As to changing the amount of it shows 52 weeks of the new rate, then I would be changing it with the explanation that I received one week at the old rate and 51 weeks of the new rate. 

I would be changing it as you suggest and wouldn’t bother giving any explanation 

Dazed_and_C0nfused

Just not for 2022:23 😉