finding new homes for contents of house before probate

silversnail

My dad has sadly died, and we have his house to sell.  We are wondering if it is ok to clear the house before probate is granted.  There isn't anything of value, just furniture like sofa, dining table, beds, chests of drawers, fridge etc; one or two pieces may go to family members, but we may put bits and pieces on ebay or marketplace, or give things to charity.  None of us live near the house, so ideally we don't want to leave it all till the house is sold further down the line, but rather do it gradually over time if possible.  Inheritance tax is not due, but we will still apply for probate.  We can give the solicitors a figure to say what things are worth in total, but it won't be very high. Please can someone advise what is and isn't allowed, as when I use the all-wise google, I keep getting different answers. Thanks so much in advance.

SiliconChip

Condolences for your loss. In theory if probate is required then you (I assume you are the executor, or one of them) shouldn't dispose of any items until it's been granted. However, if the beneficiaries of the Will are not going to make a fuss about it then it's unlikely that anybody else is going to be concerned if you do sell or give away things.

What I did when my mum died was make an inventory of the contents of the house, went through the list with my fellow executor to assign a nominal value to each item (which in some cases was zero) then as each was disposed of made a note of what happened to it and if any money was received for it. Then when I finalised the estate accounts after the house was sold the cash was included in the distribution to beneficiaries, as well as the value of any items that were given to beneficiaries reducing the amount of cash they received.

Sarahspangles

We’ve just gone through this - we moved some of the furniture to the garage when we cleared the personal possessions and used some of the remaining items to ‘stage’ the house to give prospective buyers an idea of the layouts offered by the rooms.

We stated a nominal value for probate but aren’t planning to sell anything.  Instead there’s a spreadsheet with the main items listed, and family have put their names against items they would like. 

We’ve already had one visit from British Heart Foundation to take surplus items.  If you have a BHF locally our experience is that they’re very organised, you can list what you have to donate on a webform and they will turn up with a van at the agreed time and date. 

Once we’d set out the rooms we actually spent a couple of hundred on things like new duvet covers to coordinate with the decluttered decor.  It felt much less ‘personal’ once we had and got three offers as soon as it went on the market.

Savvy_Sue

Agree with the above, and the idea of 'staging' the house. Also as you don't live locally, there is something to be said for being able to make a cuppa, have a sit down, and maybe even stay the night when you do make a visit. Someone is going to have to inspect the property regularly anyway to keep the insurers happy: maybe you can find a neighbour? We just carried on paying Mum's gardener to keep the outside tidy and to inspect inside. 

Also if you don't live nearby, you may find a house clearance company who will partially clear and 'stage' for you. It was well worth the money, I felt. The slightly nerve-wracking part was when they phoned and said they were very busy for the next few weeks, and they could either completely clear within a week, or not for six weeks. As we'd been waiting and waiting and waiting to exchange, but expecting to then complete quickly, I agreed to this. Cannot tell you the relief I felt when two days later my solicitor phoned to say we had in face exchanged and completed on the same day. 

Sarahspangles

Savvy_Sue said:

Also as you don't live locally, there is something to be said for being able to make a cuppa, have a sit down, and maybe even stay the night when you do make a visit. Someone is going to have to inspect the property regularly anyway to keep the insurers happy: maybe you can find a neighbour?. 

We took out vacant house insurance which required weekly checks. We moved quickly to clear and prep the house for sale, and apply for probate, thinking my OH would have to keep going over, and it’s at least a two hour round trip. 

In fact the estate agent we used includes a weekly check in their standard package for sale of vacant properties, so we only need to be there for e.g. furniture collections.

Mrs_Z

Agree with Silicon Chip, if the beneficiaries are all agreeable, then there is unlikely to be an issue with it, although officially, you should really wait for the probate to come through.
Having dealt with late friend's estate last year, we started clearing the house immediately after her passing whilst waiting for probate. It made sense as she was a bit of a hoarder and I didnt live nearby, so it took several painstaking trips there and back to get the property in sellable condition. I had couple of people helping me, and there were several trips to charity shops, etc. None of the belongings were of high value and the estate was well below the inheritance tax threshold. Anything that was sold was logged onto a spreadsheet for the estate accounts.  In the end the probate took 5 months, and that time was well spent to get the property cleared. There were still items of furniture in the property when it sold!

silversnail

Thank you for the input (and the condolences). I think the staging-the-house for sale is a good plan, as it making it feel a bit less personal. So perhaps we can move personal things on, plus some of the bits of furniture, and leave others to make it look like a home.  Also like the advice of leaving a kettle and mugs to make a cuppa etc.... I have organised insurance, and a kind neighbour says she will pop in several times a week.  It is good to know we can move stuff on without getting into bother though.

getmore4less

Executor powers come from the will so they can start the process of dealing with contents there is no need for the grant.

Technically if LOA are needed then administration should wait for the grant but in practice no one polices administration it would need someone to bring it to court but that only tends to happen if a beneficial interest suspects some wrongdoing

Cloth_of_Gold

A friend of mine recently. His solicitor, who is also his executor, said that the two beneficiaries could take what they wanted from the house immediately and then it could be cleared straight away after that. I did wonder about probate being granted first but as he is a solicitor, and one who only deals in wills, probate and trusts I assume he knows what he's talking about.

Linton

We said the benficiaries could take what they want and then British Heart Foundation completely cleared the large house and garage in a day for IIRC £250 keeping what they thought they could sell.  I see no point in holding onto old stuff that no-one wants.  Just clear the lot as soon as possible.

doodling

Hi,

To emphasise @getmore4less 's comment, the executor owns (in trust for creditors and beneficiaries) everything belonging to the deceased from the moment of death. If someone died in the morning then an executor could quite legally have their house emptied and ready for sale by teatime that day (although some might consider that haste rather tasteless).

The purpose of probate is to confirm that the will in the executors hand is THE will, it is valid and that they are therefore definitely the executor.  The risks of proceeding before probate is granted are therefore related to how likely it us that someone will come along and say "I have a later will" or "the deceased was not of sound mind when they wrote that will" or "why is there no signature of a witness on that will?".

If you are dealing with a will of someone you know well, it was made when you knew they still had a full set of marbles, you are confident it is their most recent one, they haven't said anything recently about making a new one, the will looks valid and there is no-one who is going to argue with you about the will in any event then nothing stops you getting stuck in straight away if that is what works for you.

The risk you run before probate is that someone claims there is a later will, or the will you have is not valid, and you therefore aren't the executor and then claims that you have thrown away granny's priceless antique chamber pot worth millions and wants you to pay for their loss. Or more boringly that you have distributed the estate incorrectly (according to the wrong will) and it is your responsibility to retrieve it or make good out of your own pocket.