Schrodinger's Parking Ticket

skerrigan

Several months back (2pm on 28th October 2022) I made the fateful decision to stop in a car park in Birmingham near a shop I liked for 20 mins. I paid £1.20 for 1 hour's parking, grumbling at the price. The machine asked me to type in my license plate. I was half-way into the shop when I realised I'd put my old car's license plate in - they're surprisingly similar (2 of the alphanumeric characters are identical by sheer coincidence).

I walked back to the car park, looked around for an attendant (the car park is best described as a cleared junk yard with an automated machine) failed to find one, considered paying another £1.20 and then remembered I'd paid by card so I could prove payment. As I was only staying for 30 mins or so I figured it would take longer to clear this up than to just shop and go on. Boy was that an expensive decision...

Fast forward to the 26th of November. I received a letter amdist various postal strikes backdated from the 2nd of November £100 PCN charge in the post. The car parking company rejected an appeal. So did the arbitration service they directed me to theias.org. In both appeals I provided evidence that I had paid for a ticket - a bank statement showing a debit to the company's account (Zellig) and the actual ticket itself. Didn't matter - entering a wrong license plate triggers their ALS and you must pay a fine.

As you can imagine I feel this is unduly harsh - I have made reasonable efforts to prove that I did pay for my parking, and yet will be both charged for the parking AND fined due for not paying the parking apparently due to a momentary error in using their keypad interface, which is ultimately a setup for their convenience.

Can this really be legal? Do I have any grounds to challenge this? I've not heard from the car parking company since the appeal, but they'll soon be threatening me with the usual non-payment stuff.

I posted this on Reddit with some vaguer details, so apologies if you've seen this before.

B789

Major input error. They should really have come back and offered a £15-£20 admin charge for a Major Input Error. However, this is defendable.

Which PPC and which car park?

When you appealed, did you give away the drivers identity? Was their PCN POFA compliant?

Please read, re-read, digest and understand the Newbies thread near the top of this forum. That guide will tell you exactly what steps to take and what the process involves.

As you have exhausted the appeals process, if you have read the Newbies thread, you will know that you are in a figurative state of limbo. You can now expect a load of threatening, scary letters from debt collectors. As pointed out in the Newbies thread, you can safely ignore these letters and just keep them filed for reference. They are toothless bottom-dwelling scavengers with no power whatsoever to take you to court, no matter what they threaten in their scamming letters.

Do NOT engage in any form with the debt collectors. No emails, phone calls or letters. The next thing you must respond to is an LBC or County Court Claim. The PPC have up to 6 years to file a court claim for this alleged debt.

For now, please answer the questions asked above so we can best assist you. You MUST read and re-read the Newbies post though.

Half_way

These systems work on so called automatic number plate recognition a camera scans your number plate in and scans it again on the way out,  when you pay you put your number plate into the machine and the number plate you enter does not match then the vehicle with the non matching number plate is issued a parking charge notice.

Automated systems that require human input should be set up with the human factor in mind, so the vehicle enters the car park, occupant of vehicle enters an incorrect registration number and the  system throws up an error and states incorrect reg number and prevents payment with a warming to either enter correct vehicle reg or leave the car park ( i have seen some pay on exit systems that display a photo of the vehicle )

However such a set up while technically possible would mean less money for the parking companies whos only interest in car parks is to fleece the motorist

Coupon-mad

The IAS isn't independent arbitration!

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/01/is-independent-appeal-service-kangaroo.html?m=1

https://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2017/11/ipc-kangaroo-court-strikes-again.html?m=0

OMG forget Reddit.  Unless you want to give us regulars here a laugh and show us some of the clueless replies there.

Just don't believe a word of it...these firms can sue.  Some do. But read on:

You don't need to do anything at all and it's certainly not a fine.  Don't contact them and TOTALLY IGNORE £170 debt demands this year.

BUT:

Come back if you get a court claim (highly unlikely from this small fry company)!  Easy to defend. No risk.

It's Parallel Parking Ltd, isn't it? Small fry.


"Can this really be legal?"

At the moment, yes but you don't PAY of course.

Read the NEWBIES thread and read the MPs' words about the "outrageous scam" these firms operate.

The Government is stepping in and will be regulating this rogue industry by 2024.

 Do I have any grounds to challenge this? 

Yes if they try a court claim.  Of course!

You can try a complaint to your MP asking them to write to ask the IPC why this company is marginalising motorists and penalising them for VRM 'keying errors' when the BPA (rival Trade Body) doesn't allow this and the new statutory Code coming in next year says that keying errors should never be the burden of the motorist and must be cancelled in future:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/private-parking-code-of-practice/private-parking-code-of-practice

It's only temporarily withdrawn, pending a Public Consultation that you will be encouraged here to take part in.  Coming soon...

Let us know how you get on with your MP stepping in and asking him/her to write to the IPC for you, to demand to know why the IPC AOS members are not honouring the intentions of the incoming Code (the will of Parliament) despite knowing the only 2 clauses that are being revisited are the level of parking charges and the banning of the fake debt recovery £70 add-on 'fees' (that you will be seeing on your debt demands you'll be ignoring this year).