Contract of Employment?

raptorman

Dont know if anyone can help with this but here goes.

I started work with my current employer approx 16 months ago and have not recieved a contract of employment or a written statement of employment. Where do I stand legally? Has my employer broken the law by not providing these?

The reason I ask this is that I have recently been informed that I am only entitled to 12 days holiday and 8 days statutory leave. I know that other employees are getting 20 days + 8 stats. Although in my first 9 months of employment my employer told me I had 16/17 days holiday(can't remember exactly) because I had started part way into the year.

I am about to take this up with my employer but would like to know my position regards the contract and negotiating for the holiday entitlement.

By the way I work 40 hours a week and know that an employer can include statutory holidays in your holiday entitlement.

Any help with this greatly appreciated.

fatbelly

You have a statutory right to written terms and conditions within two months of starting work but still many employers don't produce them. Try requesting them in writing. Did you get the 16/17 days for 9 months in writing? If you can prove it, there's a change in terms and conditions - raise a grievance. Otherwise, as you say, he's allowed to give you 12+8 days. Not exactly generous, though, is it?

raptorman

Fatbelly

I have nothing in writing from my employer regards any of my employment.
Do you think I have a right to negotiate my terms now?

brm_2

raptorman wrote:

Dont know if anyone can help with this but here goes.

I started work with my current employer approx 16 months ago and have not recieved a contract of employment or a written statement of employment. Where do I stand legally? Has my employer broken the law by not providing these?

The reason I ask this is that I have recently been informed that I am only entitled to 12 days holiday and 8 days statutory leave. I know that other employees are getting 20 days + 8 stats. Although in my first 9 months of employment my employer told me I had 16/17 days holiday(can't remember exactly) because I had started part way into the year.

I am about to take this up with my employer but would like to know my position regards the contract and negotiating for the holiday entitlement.

By the way I work 40 hours a week and know that an employer can include statutory holidays in your holiday entitlement.

Any help with this greatly appreciated.

I can only say that you need to take legal advice on this problem,
or, leave the company.

It seems to me that you are being 'st--fed', sorry.

fatbelly

raptorman wrote:

I have nothing in writing from my employer regards any of my employment.
Do you think I have a right to negotiate my terms now?

A contract already exists because you are working for them and they are paying you.

If they want to change the terms and conditions, you can accept them or raise a grievance. But you can't continue working indefinitely 'under protest'. Eventually you have to either accept the change or resign (and try for constructive dismissal).

If you want to change the terms and conditions...yes, negotiate...and best of luck to you. Let us know how you get on.

Savvy_Sue

ACAS website has useful stuff on employment rights and contracts. I have a feeling that if you haven't been given a contract, then you are entitled to certain statutory provisions, eg right to notice etc.

But it's unusual for one person to have less leave entitlement than everyone else. Can your employer give a reason for it?

raptorman

Savvy_Sue wrote:

ACAS website has useful stuff on employment rights and contracts. I have a feeling that if you haven't been given a contract, then you are entitled to certain statutory provisions, eg right to notice etc.

But it's unusual for one person to have less leave entitlement than everyone else. Can your employer give a reason for it?

I think the reason they have more holiday entitlement is because they have worked there longer i.e. they are on older contracts.

Although I have just found out that everyone was invited to a meeting to agree and sign contracts about a month after I started, but I was never told about this or invited.

Bargainloverbec

As Fatbelly said a contract does exist because you are already working for them, but you are entitled to a Written Statement of Particulars of Employment within 2 months of beginning employment. The legislation governing this is the Employment Rights Act 1996 Section 1. You can apply to an Employment Tribunal if you have not received it however you won't get any compensation, all they will do is determine what should have been put in writing to you and ensure that you get it.

As for the holiday query, I'm sorry to say that the legal requirement for a minimum of 4 weeks off (ie. 20 days) can include bank holidays. So basically your employer is being really tight but not doing anything illegal.

Your options for resolving it are as follows:

Written statement - raise a formal grievance (even if your employer doesn't have a grievance policy you are covered by the Dispute Resolution Regulation which came into force 1 Oct 2004). If no satisfaction then apply to a tribunal but it is important that you raise the grievance first otherwise the tribunal will just send your application back.

Holidays - again I would query it and if necessary raise a grievance. If the people who get more holiday than you are of the opposite sex you could possibly make a tribunal claim under the Equal Pay or Sex Discrimination Acts. If you chose to resign over it you could put in a claim for constructive dismissal because of the unfair treatment but it is quite hard to prove so I wouldn't go down that path unless working conditions were unbearable.

I'm actually geeky enough that I do this for a living (can you tell!?) and I always advise people to try and resolve things informally with their manager first - it normally achieves a better outcome than quoting legislation at people and playing hardball.

Hope this helps but let me know if you need any more info.

raptorman

Just a quick update.

I spoke to my boss yesterday and was told that everyone who startred within the last 2 years was only getting 12 days + 8 Stats holiday entitlement. The only trouble with that is that I know that one member of staff who started after me actually negotiated their contract to get the better holiday entitlement. My boss will not change my holiday entitlement because he says he would have to change everyone's and that would cost him more money.

Is it legal that my boss can negotiate a contract with one member of staff but not with me?

To be honest I actually really enjoy my job and am happy to do everything that is asked of me without question, and really don't want to have to leave.

Your replies are greatly appreciated.

Savvy_Sue

raptorman wrote:

I spoke to my boss yesterday and was told that everyone who startred within the last 2 years was only getting 12 days + 8 Stats holiday entitlement. The only trouble with that is that I know that one member of staff who started after me actually negotiated their contract to get the better holiday entitlement. My boss will not change my holiday entitlement because he says he would have to change everyone's and that would cost him more money.

Is it legal that my boss can negotiate a contract with one member of staff but not with me?

I think it is, especially if the contract was negotiated differently from the start. It's not uncommon for a job to be offered at a salary of between x and y, the co. really wants to appoint at x, but the best candidate says I will not work for x, pay me at least z or I will go elsewhere.

With holiday, I don't think I would work for 12 + 8 stats and would say "that's not enough holiday give me more or I go elsewhere."

You could try asking for a 2 day increase for every year you stay, or something like that!

Sorry, got to dash, hope that makes sense.

Murtle

did you take your 16/17 days entitlement that you were told you had? or have it booked off?? then you could show that your holiday has been reduced???

Good luck