Gov't support

savers_united

We already know what is on the table in terms of financial support, but that support was announced when the cap was predicted to hit £2800 in October and to last until April, but with Fridays cap announment now expected to be over £3500 and in January over £4000, the question on many peoples lips across the country will be what further if any support will be offered.

It's been mentioned on a number of threads and discussed, but be good to know people's views of what they would like to see done and what they actually think will be announced once we have a new PM.

For me I would like to see and what I think we may get is the £400 support upped to £600 to the give an even £100pm towards bills for the 6mth winter period and then targeted support in some cases doubling what has already been announced for those most vulnerable. I don't think much more at this stage can be announced with bills likely to go even higher next year.

The labour price freeze I think it's a non starters for a number of reasons. 

My fear is that without upping the £400, borderline families that are working and seeing rising costs with mortgages, fuel, food, childcare etc are going to struggle and fall into debt, with bills tripling it will help but not solve the problems fully so people still need to cut back. 

The most vulnerable are just not going to be able to afford these increases and will need some extra help so at least their essential needs are met. £2000 should for them offset the majority of the increases we have seen and help towards general rising prices.

I don't think the above will be inflationary and like always there will be winners and losers and people upset with wealthy people getting Gov't grants but it will be done the quickest and will less admin, this will give us time to get through this period so that the package can be fine tuned and only given to those who need it as things develop. 

DE_612183

Agreed more help is needed - the £400 will cost £11.7 billion pounds which is eyewatering in itself - if you up to £600 then that's about another £6billion.

The £11.7bn is part of the £37bn package - although that's a drop in the ocean to the circa £400bn that Covid has cost.

[Deleted User]

All that giving rebates does is kick the can down the road.

At what point do the people who think increasing the rebate is needed agree that it should stop?  Or is it just free money forever?

Astria

DE_612183 said:

Agreed more help is needed - the £400 will cost £11.7 billion pounds which is eyewatering in itself - if you up to £600 then that's about another £6billion.

The £11.7bn is part of the £37bn package - although that's a drop in the ocean to the circa £400bn that Covid has cost.

and we need to payback the 400bn that covid has cost yet. The cost of living crisis will improve that a little with the extra tax however.

We can't just keep borrowing. We have to pay it back someday, somehow...

Section62

[Deleted User] said:

All that giving rebates does is kick the can down the road.

At what point do the people who think increasing the rebate is needed agree that it should stop?  Or is it just free money forever?

Like the £20/week UC uplift due to Covid.

Once you start giving it is politically very difficult to stop, even when conditions have returned to 'normal'.

Mstty

I don't want to see any more help to January.

People need a big shock, education on energy and usage and to cut down their usage. Without this shock this will have to be funded for many years and the country is broke already.

There are a lot of people which have high usage due to disabilities and illness and yes they need targeting as well as those that legitimately are heat or eat (but again education on how not to waste energy should be a part of any handouts)

No more money for all and invest this in UK power generation, generation.that occurs all times of the day and especially in winter (Hydro and Nuclear fit this bill)

We all.have a tough time for a few years but solve the problems.for.future generations.

The selfish response is give me money now.and don't invest in the future which is where populist opinion potentially sits.

savers_united

Mstty said:

I don't want to see any more help to January.

People need a big shock, education on energy and usage and to cut down their usage. Without this shock this will have to be funded for many years and the country is broke already.

There are a lot of people.which have high sugar due to disabilities and illness and yes they need targeting as well as those that legitimately are heat or eat (but again education on how not to waste energy should be a part of any handouts)

No more money for all and invest this in UK power generation, generation.that occurs all times of the day and especially in winter (Hydro and Nuclear fit this bill)

We all.have a tough time for a few years but solve the problems.for.future generations.

The selfish response is give me money now.and don't invest in the future which is where populist opinion potentially sits.

I don't disagree with the sentiment and there is / was alot of wasted energy and this is a wake up call that many will need.
But it's just the scale and speed of the increases that I feel warrants these Interventions, people have just not had time to adjust enough to offset these increases. Alot can just suck it up, our bills have increased from £87, 18 mths ago to £200pm now, I know with my current tariffs in place until July 23 it will cover me at £2400 per annum Inc the £400 grant.

I have had 2 decent pay rises in 2 years and the wife has had promotion in the last 6mths so we are fine and for as many like us who will be fine there are going to be alot more I feel who are going to be hit hard, the wider social impact of this is what worries me and with everyone I guess cutting back on their spending the wider economic impact. 

[Deleted User]

Same question - when should it stop?  Or should there be another set of rebates for the next rise?

Even if there isn't another rise (which of course there will be), we've just delayed the increases until a few months in the future and hidden some of the cost in general taxation temporarily.

What figure would you put on "scale and speed" that requires support?

savers_united

[Deleted User] said:

Same question - when should it stop?  Or should there be another set of rebates for the next rise?

Even if there isn't another rise (which of course there will be), we've just delayed the increases until a few months in the future and hidden some of the cost in general taxation temporarily.

What figure would you put on "scale and speed" that requires support?

We cannot keep supporting these energy rises indefinitely, there will need to be an exit strategy, but prices are likely to quadruple by April from where they were 2 years prior. Wages have not kept up with that scale of increase and neither have the benefits system.

Alot of it is Gov't failure with strategic energy supply, storage and mix. There has been a failure to properly improve housing stock, support energy reduction programmes and educate people on energy use. Even new builds fall short of where they should be today. 

It is difficult to predict when this will end and prices ease back, the problem is if nothing is done then even when things return to some kind of normality there could be lasting damage that will cost us even more over the longer term. 
There are no easy answers and it's not going to be cheap whatever route we take. 

jimjames

Mstty said:

I don't want to see any more help to January.

People need a big shock, education on energy and usage and to cut down their usage. Without this shock this will have to be funded for many years and the country is broke already.

It will be fascinating come Christmas time to see how many houses have lights on 24/7 that could light up the moon. When energy is cheap no-one bothers about cutting usage, like you say it needs something to change that mindset like with fuel and people then saying "well I won't drive, I'll walk".

[Deleted User]

jimjames said:

Mstty said:

I don't want to see any more help to January.

People need a big shock, education on energy and usage and to cut down their usage. Without this shock this will have to be funded for many years and the country is broke already.

It will be fascinating come Christmas time to see how many houses have lights on 24/7 that could light up the moon. When energy is cheap no-one bothers about cutting usage, like you say it needs something to change that mindset like with fuel and people then saying "well I won't drive, I'll walk".

When energy was cheap, everyone got used to wasting it.  Now energy is expensive, everyone says "OMG, please subsidise me".