Arrangement Fees from Advisors for Equity Release - Do I need one?

Leodogger

MWT said:

Leodogger said:

I just wrote to my solicitor to ask if a Lender can put a first charge on the Land Registry title if there is a Form A Restriction without removing the restriction and this is what she replied back with :   "It will be on your deeds? Can you scan a copy to me of your up to date office copy entries or even forward that to your lender" !!!    I have no idea what she is referring to as "office copy entries"?   Do you ?   She drew up the PP Trust so surely she knows what is on the Land Registry and Deeds?    Or am I being naive here?   By the way you have summarised our current position correctly.

She will know what they filed at the time, but that is not necessarily what is there now, so she is just asking you to obtain copy of the register of title (also known as office copy entry) and send it to her, or to the lender to get the answer as she is rightly inferring that it is really a question for the lender...

The question I would have asked her is will the existence of a first charge over the property interfere with the ability to put the 50% ownership of the deceased into the Property Protection Trust? - this is something that wasn't a factor when you formed the strategy with your wills and the trust so may not have been discussed at the time...

You could be right.    No she never mentioned the affect any further lending would have on the Trust but from what the Lenders are saying, they wouldn't accept the PP Trust being in existence and are insisting that we would need to remove it.   What I want to know is how they know the Trust has been removed if there is no evidence of it being in existence at the Land Registry and from everyone is saying on this thread, there would be NO record of it at the Land Registry?

MWT

I suspect we have at least answered the original question you posed at the start of this thread, yes, you do need a good advisor and one that is going to be motivated to put the time into helping you navigate through all this, so likely one at the higher end of the fee scale.

Re the trust being in existence, I am not 100% sure that those you have spoken to appreciate that it is an empty trust at this point with no ownership of the property. If the trust did own any part of the property already then it would have to be removed, that part should not be in doubt.

I would also suggest that talking directly to the lenders is not ideal as on the one hand they cannot give you regulated advice directly and on the other-hand those you may speak to on an initial inquiry are not going to fully appreciate the details of your situation, that really is something for your advisor to help you with...

Leodogger

MWT said:

I suspect we have at least answered the original question you posed at the start of this thread, yes, you do need a good advisor and one that is going to be motivated to put the time into helping you navigate through all this, so likely one at the higher end of the fee scale.

Re the trust being in existence, I am not 100% sure that those you have spoken to appreciate that it is an empty trust at this point with no ownership of the property. If the trust did own any part of the property already then it would have to be removed, that part should not be in doubt.

I would also suggest that talking directly to the lenders is not ideal as on the one hand they cannot give you regulated advice directly and on the other-hand those you may speak to on an initial inquiry are not going to fully appreciate the details of your situation, that really is something for your advisor to help you with...

Well the advisors seem to be as knowledgeable as me !    All they said was "you would have to get the PP Trust removed before a Lender would advance you equity release.   They don't seem to know either about the Form A Restriction and whether it can be left in place.   All they told me was to consult my solicitor, which I have done as I have related above.

I have been around and around in circles on this, god help anyone who is not up to researching and trying to find out what is needed.   I have the feeling I would have ended up applying for the ER and would have been turned down half way through the process and sent back to Square 1 which is where I am still at at the moment !

mrsnobody

Leodogger said:

MWT said:

I suspect we have at least answered the original question you posed at the start of this thread, yes, you do need a good advisor and one that is going to be motivated to put the time into helping you navigate through all this, so likely one at the higher end of the fee scale.

Re the trust being in existence, I am not 100% sure that those you have spoken to appreciate that it is an empty trust at this point with no ownership of the property. If the trust did own any part of the property already then it would have to be removed, that part should not be in doubt.

I would also suggest that talking directly to the lenders is not ideal as on the one hand they cannot give you regulated advice directly and on the other-hand those you may speak to on an initial inquiry are not going to fully appreciate the details of your situation, that really is something for your advisor to help you with...

Well the advisors seem to be as knowledgeable as me !    All they said was "you would have to get the PP Trust removed before a Lender would advance you equity release.   They don't seem to know either about the Form A Restriction and whether it can be left in place.   All they told me was to consult my solicitor, which I have done as I have related above.

I have been around and around in circles on this, god help anyone who is not up to researching and trying to find out what is needed.   I have the feeling I would have ended up applying for the ER and would have been turned down half way through the process and sent back to Square 1 which is where I am still at at the moment !

I completely agree with MWT that the lenders/advisers you have been speaking to appear to have misunderstood the situation and/or the terminology regarding the trust.  My understanding is (and please note I am not an expert in trusts, so you should verify with a solicitor) your current arrangement only creates a will trust upon the death of one of you, which is acceptable to LTM lenders if you apply whilst both of you are alive.  If your property was already placed in trust (which is what I think the lender and adviser you have spoken to have assumed), then the property would not show in your names at Land Registry, it would be in the name(s) of the trustee(s) or there would be a different restriction against the title, and this is how the lender would know of the existence of the trust.  If you have a look at the Equity Release Council website, www.equityrelease council.com, you can find a list of solicitors who specialise in equity release and contact one of them for advice.

Leodogger

mrsnobody said:

Leodogger said:

MWT said:

I suspect we have at least answered the original question you posed at the start of this thread, yes, you do need a good advisor and one that is going to be motivated to put the time into helping you navigate through all this, so likely one at the higher end of the fee scale.

Re the trust being in existence, I am not 100% sure that those you have spoken to appreciate that it is an empty trust at this point with no ownership of the property. If the trust did own any part of the property already then it would have to be removed, that part should not be in doubt.

I would also suggest that talking directly to the lenders is not ideal as on the one hand they cannot give you regulated advice directly and on the other-hand those you may speak to on an initial inquiry are not going to fully appreciate the details of your situation, that really is something for your advisor to help you with...

Well the advisors seem to be as knowledgeable as me !    All they said was "you would have to get the PP Trust removed before a Lender would advance you equity release.   They don't seem to know either about the Form A Restriction and whether it can be left in place.   All they told me was to consult my solicitor, which I have done as I have related above.

I have been around and around in circles on this, god help anyone who is not up to researching and trying to find out what is needed.   I have the feeling I would have ended up applying for the ER and would have been turned down half way through the process and sent back to Square 1 which is where I am still at at the moment !

I completely agree with MWT that the lenders/advisers you have been speaking to appear to have misunderstood the situation and/or the terminology regarding the trust.  My understanding is (and please note I am not an expert in trusts, so you should verify with a solicitor) your current arrangement only creates a will trust upon the death of one of you, which is acceptable to LTM lenders if you apply whilst both of you are alive.  If your property was already placed in trust (which is what I think the lender and adviser you have spoken to have assumed), then the property would not show in your names at Land Registry, it would be in the name(s) of the trustee(s) or there would be a different restriction against the title, and this is how the lender would know of the existence of the trust.  If you have a look at the Equity Release Council website, www.equityrelease council.com, you can find a list of solicitors who specialise in equity release and contact one of them for advice.

Thanks I think you are correct and the Trust is not yet in force as we are both still alive and after having explained again to our solicitor who drew up the Trust what I needed to know, she has come back with a reply to the effect that there is no Form A Restriction on the Title which means we just need to get new wills done which will save us a fortune !

Leodogger

We are now booked with a solicitor to get our wills changed and we will have to play it by ear after that and hope that there is no more impediments to us obtaining the ER.

Can I thank everyone on this very long thread for their contributions and trying to untangle what I needed, it was very much appreciated !!    What would we do without Moneysaving Expert for advice, the people on here never let you down!

Thanks everyone !