sister's housing benefit stopped due to moving house

hungry_hippo

Hi
I'm just after some advice on behalf of my sister.  She lived in a property in London for the last 3 years and recently had to move house due to the landlord selling the house.  She is unable to work due to suffering from severe schizophrenia and receives ESA and housing benefit.  This is her only income apart from money my mum (a retired pensioner) gives to her as living cost support. She moved to a new property about a month ago, and filled out the local council's change of circumstances form to notify housing benefits of the move, several weeks before moving. She only moved around the corner so was in the same local authority area, therefore entitled to continued housing benefit and not starting a new Universal Credit Claim.  She sent in a bank statement as proof of identity and was advised her claim was being processed (by email). 

That month, my mum had given my sister quite a bit of money (I don't know how much) to help her with living cost support, so it may have looked like she had plenty of money, more than maybe what a typical person on benefits would have.

After a month of not hearing anything about her claim, she received a letter today from the council stating that her housing benefit claim had been stopped and she was no longer entitled to receive any housing benefit (no reason given in the letter, just call xxxxx). Also that she would have to repay part of her last benefit claim and this would be taken off her council tax bill!  Myself and my mum are rent guarantors for my sister so my mum has paid her rent this month, though I'll probably have to step in next month as my mum's pension won't stretch that far, so this is a real dread for me as London rents are so high. 

My sister called the benefits people who told her it was because she had moved outside of the local authority area.  I told my sister to ring them back as this was clearly wrong, then she was told a different reason, that it was because she'd sent an email to the council advising that her moving house date had changed. This is true, my sister did tell them the original date but then it got changed by 4 days (by us) because my mum needed to get the cleaners in before the moving could go ahead. I don't know why my sister felt  the need to tell the benefits agency this new detail after submitting her original claim and date (she can't think properly logically), but she did.

The person at the council on the phone then said she would have to reapply for housing benefit again and they'll send her out a new form. I don't have much confidence in what they are saying though as the reasons for stopping it make little sense to me (no reason in the letter, not in the local authority area when she was was by the first person on the phone, then a moving house date change by 4 days by the second person on the phone??) I mean, she was clearing moving, had no income other than ESA / my mum giving her money, and that hasn't changed!  So why cancel her claim and benefit!

Has anyone had an experience like this before?  Can they just cancel your benefit because of the reason's I've listed!!  Did someone look at my sister's bank statement and think she had too much money for someone on housing benefit (because my mum gave her money that month!) and cancel it without any proper financial re-assessment, or am I just over-thinking it!

Thanks
Pete

Rubyroobs

Sorry I can't answer the questions about the housing benefit, but has your sister ever thought about claiming PIP ? It sounds like she would qualify if her mental health problems are severe.

hungry_hippo

Hi, thanks I've not heard of PIP before, but I'll definitely mention it to my mum and sister.  Have just been having a look at the requirements and yes, a number of them I think are applicable - maybe not all the time at their highest level of severity, but during persistent flare ups and voices episodes etc 

calcotti

hungry_hippo said:..- maybe not all the time at their highest level of severity, but during persistent flare ups and voices episodes etc 

What matters is how she is on the majority of days.

If the council were unclear about the moving date and therefore what the rent liability was they may have suspended the claim because they would not have known what was due.

Unfortunately the only way this can be resolved is through the council.

Rubyroobs

hungry_hippo said:

Hi, thanks I've not heard of PIP before, but I'll definitely mention it to my mum and sister.  Have just been having a look at the requirements and yes, a number of them I think are applicable - maybe not all the time at their highest level of severity, but during persistent flare ups and voices episodes etc 

It sounds like it would definitely be worth applying. Maybe see if she can get help from CAB or a mental health charity to support the claim. It can take a while to get a PIP award but could help significantly and if she is in receipt of income related ESA and lives alone and no-one will be claiming carers allowance for caring for her then it could also mean the addition of a severe disability premium on her ESA which could also make a significant difference to her income.

hungry_hippo

Rubyroobs said:

hungry_hippo said:

Hi, thanks I've not heard of PIP before, but I'll definitely mention it to my mum and sister.  Have just been having a look at the requirements and yes, a number of them I think are applicable - maybe not all the time at their highest level of severity, but during persistent flare ups and voices episodes etc 

It sounds like it would definitely be worth applying. Maybe see if she can get help from CAB or a mental health charity to support the claim. It can take a while to get a PIP award but could help significantly and if she is in receipt of income related ESA and lives alone and no-one will be claiming carers allowance for caring for her then it could also mean the addition of a severe disability premium on her ESA which could also make a significant difference to her income.

Thanks, I've found this online so I'll as her to do it and see what score comes back:  
https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-self-test

She lives alone, she's divorced, has a 12 year old son who lives with his grandparents, but she sees him regularly.  I guess one of my long term concerns is she is really financially dependent on my mum who's 75.  My mum's health isn't that great so if she passes away in the future and the circumstances are the same, I'm not sure how I could find the extra money myself each month to pay to her, that my mum currently does from her pension  

My mum's a retired nurse and has an NHS pension, I did read about adult dependents pensions that can be paid to a dependent child in some circumstances, not sure if the length of time you've been retired affects if it can be passed over to someone
 else: https://www.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/sites/default/files/2021-07/Survivors Guide (V10) 07.2021.pdf

poppy12345

hungry_hippo said:

Rubyroobs said:

hungry_hippo said:

Hi, thanks I've not heard of PIP before, but I'll definitely mention it to my mum and sister.  Have just been having a look at the requirements and yes, a number of them I think are applicable - maybe not all the time at their highest level of severity, but during persistent flare ups and voices episodes etc 

It sounds like it would definitely be worth applying. Maybe see if she can get help from CAB or a mental health charity to support the claim. It can take a while to get a PIP award but could help significantly and if she is in receipt of income related ESA and lives alone and no-one will be claiming carers allowance for caring for her then it could also mean the addition of a severe disability premium on her ESA which could also make a significant difference to her income.

Thanks, I've found this online so I'll as her to do it and see what score comes back:  
https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/personal-independence-payment-pip/pip-self-test

In my opinion that's not a very reliable source if you don't fully understand the descriptors and what they means, very few people do.

Spoonie_Turtle

More detailed PIP information here:

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/how-decisions-are-made/

https://www.mentalhealthandmoneyadvice.org/en/welfare-benefits/pip-mental-health-guide/help-with-your-pip-claim/

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

hungry_hippo

Hi

I've got a slight update on this which I would appreciate some advice on. 

I've sent a letter to the council asking for a review of the housing benefit assessment (along with authorisation from my sister to speak on her behalf), and also for an explanation of why it was stopped.  I didn't know before, but my sister gives my mum most of the housing benefit each month, and my mum pays the rent for her using this (and adds her own contribution). They do it this way because it's easier for my mum to manage my sister's finances, my mum is a rent guarantor and my sister gets easily muddled up. 

If someone from the council who stopped the benefit looked at the bank statement that my sister sent (it was sent for moving house ID not financial assessment), they might have thought my sister wasn't paying rent because she was giving most of it to my mum via bank transfer, not direct to a landlord.  

It is ok to do this isn't it?  I mean whether my sister gives my mum the benefit and mum pays the rent, or whether my sister pays the rent and my mum transfers her a fixed amount every month, it's the same thing essentially ie. sister's tenancy agreement obligated rent is being paid with the housing benefit, and the rest is provided by my mum.

Thanks 
Pete

poppy12345

It will be fine that your sister gave the rent to your mum to pay it on her behalf. All they're interested in is liability to pay rent and not how it's paid.

hungry_hippo

thanks @poppy12345, was worrying about it!