Would it be foolish to stop work at 52?

CookieMonster

Albermarle said:

On the other hand a grocery shopping bill of £200 a month is rather low , unless you are teetotal and always buying cheap food .

I'm teetotal and I shop at Aldi/Co-Op (Aldi have really good steaks):
£120 a month for one person (who can cook from scratch) is fairly easy to do.

Albermarle

CookieMonster said:

Albermarle said:

On the other hand a grocery shopping bill of £200 a month is rather low , unless you are teetotal and always buying cheap food .

I'm teetotal and I shop at Aldi/Co-Op (Aldi have really good steaks):
£120 a month for one person (who can cook from scratch) is fairly easy to do.

Yes if you want to, I am sure it is possible . However the average retiree , who could afford to do so , would I am sure prefer to spend somewhat more than that . Especially if they were not eating out very often , which can be a lot more expensive than spending a bit more at the supermarket.

GazzaBloom

Albermarle said:

robatwork said:

To get back on track... just a general comment about this particular forum. As well as being one of the most useful and realistic resources for UK (pre) pensioners, it tends to err on the side of financial surety. I've seen threads where £30k or even £40k wasn't seen as enough to live comfortably in retirement.

Obviously it depends on your lifestyle, but just bear it in mind. In your position I'd be leaving my detested job as soon as I could. 

In the unlikely worst case there are still jobs available to people in their 50s. 

The retirement surveys indicate that a couple need around £45K - £50K after tax to have a comfortable retirement with some luxuries . 

Retirement living standards | Loughborough University (lboro.ac.uk)

That would not be a proper luxury retirement, as that would cost triple that probably .

Those figures seem high to me, I have detailed calculations for spend in retirement, albeit, in today's money, that I update regularly based on current monthly bills and expenditure.

We're mortgage and debt free and to cover all household bills, car fuel, road tax, MOT & annual servicing for 1 car, allowances for Christmas & birthday presents plus £500 a month pocket money each we will need just under £30K net of tax in today's money. That's our baseline everyday living amount. Holidays & money for new car would be extra and I consider those luxuries where the amount required can vary and flex considerably.

Oh, and my wife retires on Thursday, 2 weeks before her 52nd birthday! We have been planning this for several years.
 

Kim1965

robatwork said:

Albermarle said:

robatwork said:

Albermarle said:

robatwork said:

To get back on track... just a general comment about this particular forum. As well as being one of the most useful and realistic resources for UK (pre) pensioners, it tends to err on the side of financial surety. I've seen threads where £30k or even £40k wasn't seen as enough to live comfortably in retirement.

Obviously it depends on your lifestyle, but just bear it in mind. In your position I'd be leaving my detested job as soon as I could. 

In the unlikely worst case there are still jobs available to people in their 50s. 

The retirement surveys indicate that a couple need around £45K - £50K after tax to have a comfortable retirement with some luxuries . 

Retirement living standards | Loughborough University (lboro.ac.uk)

That would not be a proper luxury retirement, as that would cost triple that probably .

The problem with those kind of surveys/reports is - apart from unforgivably not being able to scroll to the right to actually read the thing (had to reduce page size to 75%) - their numbers are too generic. A "Moderate" single person spends £750 on clothes/footwear yearly? I haven't ever spent that yearly!

Yes the clothing/shoes  spend does stand out as somewhat OTT . On the other hand a grocery shopping bill of £200 a month is rather low , unless you are teetotal and always buying cheap food .
I think the overall figures look about right . Although it seems that some can manage on a lot less.

I agree that many on these forums are high salary earners and have big pension plans.  Good for them.  We feel pretty sure we would be fine with £2-2.5k per year 

Well yes, I tend to spend £300 a pop at Costco but their food (and bog roll) is good quality and lasts for weeks in the freezer (not the bog roll unless it's a special occasion). I've done my own sums and think it's more than possible to live on £25k pa and have holidays and a decent car. Given the way the cost of living is going however unless it's index linked I may have to revise this.

That final line you quoted in italics was from ChocolateWombat and I'm sure a typo for per month.

Is that 25k for a single petson or couple?
£200 pm for a singke person in aldi is very doable including some beer and wine (not to feeda habit tho). 
 10.2 k for a single person to cover basics would seem a struggle though, at that level a person would have to watch every penny, it would be a drag. Are there any singletons on this site who manage in such low incomes? 

ChocolateWombat

Yes a typo.  Thinking we can manage on £2-2.5k per month.

However, it’s not a case that that would be all there was available.  We will have £100k in savings/investments.  There will always be the option to take either of the DB pensions a bit early to boost earlier income.  It would probably be wise as we really won’t need £55k per year from 67 when the state pension kicks in too.

So when I say £2-2.5k per month, that’s a prediction of spending.  We often spend around £2k over. I think now without making particular efforts to be frugal,

For the period fromwhen I’m 52 and probably stop working, DH will bring in £3k net per month, plus we get £500 per month from the buy to let too.  That S after we’ve paid the agent and tax and allowed something for voids or maintenance.  We also have £10k put aside for any projects and add a couple of £k per year to that so we don’t worry about ending to spends a bit on the BTL now and then…it’s all part of having one.

I guess it’s 60-65 that might be hardest for us.  My DB pension will be paying out £15k,  we will have the BTL £6k and we intend to use some of my pension lump sum to top up whatever role we need until 65 when DHs first DB pension of £12k starts paying out.  We could always take it a bit earlier.

We would never be living hand-to-mouth - it’s just not our nature to do that.  There will alway be sums of money tucked away that can be accessed or adjustments to when the pensions pay out to boost income if needed.  It seems daft to release revenue streams early and suffer actuarial reduction  though, if you’re just going to sit in that income and don’t actually need it…apart from getting some tax feee income I suppose.  But is it worth taking it so you get some tax free if you lose 4-5% per year by doing so?  It feels best to leave it until the date it’s meant to lay out and will give the max, if it’s. It needed for lvi8 g…but perhaps I’m wrong there.

DT2001

ChocolateWombat said:

Yes a typo.  Thinking we can manage on £2-2.5k per month.

However, it’s not a case that that would be all there was available.  We will have £100k in savings/investments.  There will always be the option to take either of the DB pensions a bit early to boost earlier income.  It would probably be wise as we really won’t need £55k per year from 67 when the state pension kicks in too.

So when I say £2-2.5k per month, that’s a prediction of spending.  We often spend around £2k over. I think now without making particular efforts to be frugal,

For the period fromwhen I’m 52 and probably stop working, DH will bring in £3k net per month, plus we get £500 per month from the buy to let too.  That S after we’ve paid the agent and tax and allowed something for voids or maintenance.  We also have £10k put aside for any projects and add a couple of £k per year to that so we don’t worry about ending to spends a bit on the BTL now and then…it’s all part of having one.

I guess it’s 60-65 that might be hardest for us.  My DB pension will be paying out £15k,  we will have the BTL £6k and we intend to use some of my pension lump sum to top up whatever role we need until 65 when DHs first DB pension of £12k starts paying out.  We could always take it a bit earlier.

We would never be living hand-to-mouth - it’s just not our nature to do that.  There will alway be sums of money tucked away that can be accessed or adjustments to when the pensions pay out to boost income if needed.  It seems daft to release revenue streams early and suffer actuarial reduction  though, if you’re just going to sit in that income and don’t actually need it…apart from getting some tax feee income I suppose.  But is it worth taking it so you get some tax free if you lose 4-5% per year by doing so?  It feels best to leave it until the date it’s meant to lay out and will give the max, if it’s. It needed for lvi8 g…but perhaps I’m wrong there.

You are suggesting that between ages 60 - 65 is the most difficult time to generate what you need. If you take your DB pension early, when you do not need the income, you can build up a pot (even putting £3.6k gross into a SIPP) until  60-65 when you can supplement your BTL and DB. It will be when you are potentially spending most and as you say you will have excess income from 67 onwards. Create a spreadsheet to see what the reality is rather than our guesstimates.

CookieMonster

Kim1965 said:

Is that 25k for a single petson or couple?
£200 pm for a singke person in aldi is very doable including some beer and wine (not to feeda habit tho). 
 10.2 k for a single person to cover basics would seem a struggle though, at that level a person would have to watch every penny, it would be a drag. Are there any singletons on this site who manage in such low incomes? 

I've posted elsewhere on the forums about not needing much.
I'm not single but I do live alone.
Mortgage-free; I can get by well on £1200 a month - I've been doing so since Xmas as I've salary sacrificed the rest of my paycheck..
But I'm a teetotal, non-smoker with no vices other than motorcycles and I do enjoy some cheap pastimes..

By my standards I'd have the life of Riley on £1500 a month.

As for the OP, I'd retire immediately with the numbers she's talking about.
But it does depend on the retirement strategy - trying to keep funds going or deliberately running them down instead.

I'm erring towards leaving nothing behind but a small house (after I downsize) and an empty bank account...

Retireinten

Interesting thread as it resonates with me. Hate my job too but at 47 I have at least another 6 years to go before I can pack it in, so I'm making a sideways move to a company I've worked for previously in the hope the environment is more tolerable and the job itself less stressful.

Our income target is £36k net per year, which is doable with wriggle room. Plan is for hubby to work until he's 55, so another three years after I finish as he's a year younger than me. If that's considered sponging then I can live with that, given my earnings have been comfortably higher than his throughout our relationship and I've done the vast majority of the heavy lifting when it comes to home and children also. He likes his job and he's also the bigger spender so neither of us consider it unreasonable that he works a bit longer. I can tolerate working longer to fund a sensible retirement lifestyle, but my resentment levels would go through the roof if I'm working a job that has the potential to make me ill, to fund a £30k weekend car I don't want!

I do think I'll struggle to not work whilst he is though, so plan is to reach FI then look for something part time completely unrelated to my profession to give me a bit of structure and purpose and add to the cash pots.

OP,  I'd live on your planned post aged 52 income for the next two years and if that works as expected, finish work. I wouldn't write off part time work though as it has more benefits than just a pay packet. It will give you some  structure and purpose to your week, widen your social circle and of course there or jobs out there that come with attractive benefits that can help you fill your time and make savings. A family member of mine works minimum wage for a company that gives their staff free access to the facilities including the spa every month as well as cheap holidays. It fits her lifestyle in so many ways, the pay packet is just one consideration. 

Albermarle

If that's considered sponging then I can live with that,

I would not take the comments of one or two posters about sponging, to represent the majority opinion 

bluenose1

I think Chocolatewombat you have made the decision to go whatever the comments, and i dont blame you if that is what you want to do.
I suppose its all about maximising the income you do have available. With regard to BTL I would consider doing a Declaration of Trust so that 99% of the profits are classed as mine if I hadn't claimed all my personal allowance.
Definitely worth doing a calculation on whether taking your pension with actuarial deduction is worth it especially if that means there will be tax advantages for several years, though when you factor in inflation, especially if high  it may not be as attractive as it first appears. 
I would also be thinking that a £60K gift to one of my children was a lot of money, though of course we all have different opinions.
I know when i retire we will save on food bills as i would do a lot more home cooking and lets just say my husband does not have an eye for the bargains like i do. Though conversely we will spend more on holidays etc.
Only thing that is keeping me hanging on is I strongly suspect there will be a VR exercise in the next 6 months.