PCP financed car had two engine replacements

Grumpy_chap

The OP should only pay the excess mileage charge in addition to the MGFV if keeping the car, or only the excess mileage charge if returning the car.

What is the excess mileage charge?

EDITED:  Corrected the error as pointed out by Dr E below.

DrEskimo

Grumpy_chap said:

The OP should only pay the excess mileage charge in addition to the MGFV if keeping the car, or only the excess mileage charge if returning the car.

What is the excess mileage charge?

Only if returning the car to the finance company.

If you keep the car you pay the GFV only. 

Grumpy_chap

Yes, you are quite correct Dr E - I will correct my post.

The OP still seems unable to advise what the mileage charge is, but has mentioned a £4k figure, which reads as though it is the Dealer's gap between current valuation of the car and the MGFV.

Based upon the 20k miles over agreement mileage, the £4k would mean 20 pence per mile.  Can the OP confirm whether that is, or is not, what the agreement says?

longtoe44

It is 14p per mile in the agreement.

MalMonroe

I have a car on PCP with 0% interest, and it was financed by the dealership.

I was told, before I signed the agreement, that the car had been serviced every 6 months and was in good condition and had also been fully serviced by them even though it was only 3 years old. I also had 18 months MOT, 15 months warranty and 18 months free full (including home recovery) breakdown cover with the AA. I was told that if I had any problems at all I should go back to the dealership and ask them to sort them out.

Thankfully the car has been fine and I've had it for 2.5 years now but if it hadn't been fine I would have been down at the dealership telling them I wanted a replacement or a refund. I wouldn't have been car-less for six months. Because - how dare they hire/sell me a load of junk and then continue to charge me for it while I couldn't use it?!

You said "I had to pay 6 lots of £549 to have a car sit at the dealership which morally I feel the finance company should have to pay back even though I know it doesn't work that way." You are right. But why are you accepting that 'it doesn't work that way'? You could make it work that way by kicking up a fuss and reporting the shabby dealership. You have paid £3,294 for nothing. Please do contact the motor ombudsman and also Citizens Advice. You have been robbed. I do really feel sorry about it.

https://www.themotorombudsman.org/knowledge-base/what-is-the-consumer-rights-act

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/

Just because it's on a PCP agreement doesn't mean that you have no rights. Even if you'd bought it outright you would have rights.

If all else fails, you could go to the press. Anna Tims at The Guardian's very good at sorting things out for people. She helped my daughter with a PayPal problem that wasn't as bad as your problem with this dealership. (It says 'observer' but it's the Guardian too.)

your.problems @observer.co.uk

Or even your local press could help, or social media. Twitter, Facebook. 

I definitely wouldn't hire, buy or lease another vehicle from the same place. They need to be named and shamed. Rant over! Good luck. 

MalMonroe

MEM62 said:

longtoe44 said:

I though buying a 60K premium car I would have had a better experience. 

It should be but you chose a Range Rover.  Issues and failures with these vehicles are well known to the point that they should be expected.  

Blame the victim? No.

MalMonroe

DrEskimo said:

You wouldn't get a payment if you had bought the car outright, so the fact you decided to pay it monthly with interest doesn't suddenly change things.

That's not true. Whether you buy a car outright, or on terms, you do have consumer rights. And also the motor ombudsman to help. And also, I have a PCP agreement with 0% interest for the duration. 

DrEskimo

MalMonroe said:

DrEskimo said:

You wouldn't get a payment if you had bought the car outright, so the fact you decided to pay it monthly with interest doesn't suddenly change things.

That's not true. Whether you buy a car outright, or on terms, you do have consumer rights. And also the motor ombudsman to help. And also, I have a PCP agreement with 0% interest for the duration. 

I never said they had no rights. They have a right to ask for it to be repaired, and if they fail to do that, they have a right to reject the car.

My comment was specifically about getting repayments back as part of financing the cost of the car. The finance is a separate agreement the OP has with a third party finance company to spread the cost of the purchase price. It is not a monthly cost to use the car.

Grumpy_chap

longtoe44 said:

the £33,000 settlement fee
At the end of the agreement the vehicle has done 20,000 miles over the stated mileage of 40,000 miles and the car is worth £29,000 which is £4,000 less than the settlement fee. Either way I lose out. What are my options?

Grumpy_chap said:

What is the excess mileage charge?

longtoe44 said:

It is 14p per mile in the agreement.

If I understand correctly, the OP had a 4 year PCP with MGFV £33k and total mileage allowance 40k.  The OP has made all PCP payments as due, but will be 20k miles over the agreed 40k miles.  The options are therefore:

• Pay £33k and keep the car
• Pay the excess mileage charge and return the car.  20k miles x 14 pence per mile = £2.8k (or £3.4k if subject to VAT).  Not the £4k the Dealer seems to be claiming
• Trade the car in or sell elsewhere if the value can be realised at >£33k.  The OP indicates this is not possible to achieve.

The references from the Dealer about the car being worth £29k and the OP responsible for the shortfall between that £29k and the MGFV all seem to be a misunderstanding somewhere.

The excess mileage now payable would have meant lower payments throughout the term of the agreement, so the OP is probably no worse off overall.

The issues around the engine problems need to be considered separately and there is insufficient information so far for any comment in that regard.  One thing from the car being out of use for 6 months presumably means the excess mileage is lower than it would otherwise be.

[Deleted User]

MalMonroe said:

I have a car on PCP with 0% interest, and it was financed by the dealership.

I was told, before I signed the agreement, that the car had been serviced every 6 months and was in good condition and had also been fully serviced by them even though it was only 3 years old. I also had 18 months MOT, 15 months warranty and 18 months free full (including home recovery) breakdown cover with the AA. I was told that if I had any problems at all I should go back to the dealership and ask them to sort them out.

Thankfully the car has been fine and I've had it for 2.5 years now but if it hadn't been fine I would have been down at the dealership telling them I wanted a replacement or a refund. I wouldn't have been car-less for six months. Because - how dare they hire/sell me a load of junk and then continue to charge me for it while I couldn't use it?!

You said "I had to pay 6 lots of £549 to have a car sit at the dealership which morally I feel the finance company should have to pay back even though I know it doesn't work that way." You are right. But why are you accepting that 'it doesn't work that way'? You could make it work that way by kicking up a fuss and reporting the shabby dealership. You have paid £3,294 for nothing. Please do contact the motor ombudsman and also Citizens Advice. You have been robbed. I do really feel sorry about it.

https://www.themotorombudsman.org/knowledge-base/what-is-the-consumer-rights-act

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/

Just because it's on a PCP agreement doesn't mean that you have no rights. Even if you'd bought it outright you would have rights.

If all else fails, you could go to the press. Anna Tims at The Guardian's very good at sorting things out for people. She helped my daughter with a PayPal problem that wasn't as bad as your problem with this dealership. (It says 'observer' but it's the Guardian too.)

your.problems @observer.co.uk

Or even your local press could help, or social media. Twitter, Facebook. 

I definitely wouldn't hire, buy or lease another vehicle from the same place. They need to be named and shamed. Rant over! Good luck. 

Where to start...

Finance is pretty rarely done by the dealership, they wouldn't make any money that way - they get a loan for you, that pays them and you pay whoever back

If you're buying the car, you don't need to do anything at all from what the dealership says. You can't have an 18 month MOT, they could offer another one free if it had 6 months left but there is no legal way to have an 18 months MOT.

Buying a used car, you CANNOT just demand a replacement. In the first 30 days, you can ask for a refund if the car has a fault - which you need to show was there when you got it. Up to 6 months, they have to ensure it's satisfactory whereby you can ask for a part refund or for the dealer to repair it at their cost. You can eventually reject it if the repair is unsatisfactory but you will only get a pro-rata refund or compensation at a level agreed to reflect the lower value of the car due to the fault. Going all Karen down at the dealers quoting laws that don't exist and accusing them of theft is terrible advice.