Notice period dispute

lcc86

I have a full-time job and a different zero hours job with the same employer (local authority). I am leaving the full-time job but keeping the zero hours one.

I emailed HR to check they would issue my P45 as I want this linked to my main employment, and when they responded they told me my notice period was 2 months.

I checked my contract which clearly states I am on a probationary period for 26 weeks, which ends in February 2022, and that within that period my notice period is 1 month. I have sent them a copy and highlighted this, but they are adamant this doesn't apply as I was an existing employee on my zero hours contract prior to starting full-time.

My argument is that I've agreed to the terms within my contract, so I believe 1 month's notice is correct, and that if they made an error that's on them not me. Can anyone tell me if I'm wrong on this? I also told my new employer that my notice period was a month because that's what was in my contract so any dispute over this could cause issues for my new job. Can my employer force me to work 2 months notice despite this not being on my contract?

Undervalued

lcc86 said:

I have a full-time job and a different zero hours job with the same employer (local authority). I am leaving the full-time job but keeping the zero hours one.

I emailed HR to check they would issue my P45 as I want this linked to my main employment, and when they responded they told me my notice period was 2 months.

I checked my contract which clearly states I am on a probationary period for 26 weeks, which ends in February 2022, and that within that period my notice period is 1 month. I have sent them a copy and highlighted this, but they are adamant this doesn't apply as I was an existing employee on my zero hours contract prior to starting full-time.

My argument is that I've agreed to the terms within my contract, so I believe 1 month's notice is correct, and that if they made an error that's on them not me. Can anyone tell me if I'm wrong on this? I also told my new employer that my notice period was a month because that's what was in my contract so any dispute over this could cause issues for my new job. Can my employer force me to work 2 months notice despite this not being on my contract?

No, they can't force you. However if they could successfully argue that you have contractually agreed to two month notice and you fail to work it, they could make a claim against you for any unavoidable losses that causes them. Such claims are rare but they can and do happen in some circumstances. A contract of employment is not simply a sheet of paper with the word "contract" on it. It can include all kinds of other things such as the information in a staff hand book, on the company intranet, or even staff notices on the tea room wall!

Obviously though, given that you still wish to work for them on a casual / zero hour basis, they might stop offering you any such work and there would be nothing you could do about that.

Sandtree

You need to see exactly what the contract says about probationary period, some are fixed some are until your pass, some end automatically unless you fail probation some get extended automatically unless you pass probation.

Simply because there is a probation section doesnt give enough information on if it applies or not in your circumstances. 

No one can physically force anyone to  work at all let alone for a 2 month notice period however failure to meet your contractual obligations will be a breach of contract and the employer in theory would firstly sack you for gross misconduct when you dont turn up in month 2 which will hurt future references, secondly could sue you for their losses for you not turning up (eg the extra cost of having temps in or people doing overtime) and thirdly in your case you may find your second contract at risk

Its better to clarify the contractual position and ideally negotiate to one month if the contract does say its 2.

tacpot12

What do they say your length of service is? I think it likely that they are treating you as having been an employee since you started the  zero hours, job, and if they were to give you notice, I expect that they would argue that they would have to give you two months notice if they wanted to end your probationary periods. (I would get the to confirm in writing that this is the case, in case it comes in useful...)

I do think that they have it wrong though - your contract for your full-time role and your contract for your zero-hours roles are different things. They can't treat you like they can on your zero hours contract when you are doing your full-time role, so I don't see how they can say that one of the terms in the full-time contract didn't apply to you. They should have updated the contact to show the actual terms that applied to you.

As per Sandtree's advice, the only thing you can really do is try to negotiate that your notice period is one month.  

Thrugelmir

Nothing to stop you walking out of the job. Though there's no guarantee that your employer won't simply stop offering you any hours on the zero contract role. You reap what you sow. 

lcc86

Thanks for all the replies. So I read through your replies and have had a look through my contract. 

It states "your appointment will be probationary in the first instance but will be confirmed subject to satisfactory performance after 26 weeks" (which would be end of Feb 22).

Further down in the section around notice periods it states "all grades during probationary period with continuous service must give 1 months notice". It also says they can give me 1 months notice as well during this period. Nowhere does it state I need to give 2 months until after my probationary period ends.

I then had a look at the continuous service section and they've calculated my continuous service date as December 2020, which is when I started the zero hours role, so you are right @tacpot12, I hadn't noticed this before (my fault). 

I do think the two are contradictory however and I'd like to know which supercedes the other - if my continuous service is 2020 then why am I on probation? Surely that shouldn't apply if I'm not a "new" employee? Sorry just ranting a bit now, but they've treated me as a new employee in every other respect until it no longer suits them and it's frustrating. 

I will try what @Sandtree says and see if I can negotiate my notice down. Are there any tips for this? This job has unfortunately not been the best experience for me and I just want to get out as soon as I can, however I don't want to burn bridges. 

lcc86

Thrugelmir said:

Nothing to stop you walking out of the job. Though there's no guarantee that your employer won't simply stop offering you any hours on the zero contract role. You reap what you sow. 

Thanks, I'm not really sure what you mean by "you reap what you sow". I am not trying to deceive my employer in any way or burn bridges, just trying to understand whether I can "enforce" the one month period.

General_Grant

I would expect probation on the full-time job to be specific to that role.  Is the zero hours contract for a different role.  (You say it is a different job, but is the work different?)

To issue a P45, you would normally have ceased to be on their payroll.  Have they said they will issue one?

lcc86

General_Grant said:

I would expect probation on the full-time job to be specific to that role.  Is the zero hours contract for a different role.  (You say it is a different job, but is the work different?)

To issue a P45, you would normally have ceased to be on their payroll.  Have they said they will issue one?

Thats what I thought. The work is definitely different, different Pay grades and expectations. 

The reason I queried the P45 thing was because I thought I wouldn't automatically get one as I'll still be on the payroll but they said they will issue one. I'm not convinced about that as I'm only resigning from one job but will have to wait and see.

Sandtree

lcc86 said:

I will try what @Sandtree says and see if I can negotiate my notice down. Are there any tips for this? This job has unfortunately not been the best experience for me and I just want to get out as soon as I can, however I don't want to burn bridges. 

Everyone knows that people working their notice are not the most productive and so unless you have sensitive corporate knowledge companies really want to off board you as quickly as possible but don't want to be caught short handed. Negotiation is possibly the wrong word but its having a discussion and trying to show them why they'll be perfectly fine in month 2 without you.

Exactly how you do this will depend on your job etc but if I were in your boat right now in my job I'd be pointing out we have a natural breakpoint at the end of December so there is sense to have someone else start the next phase and shape it how they want to do it rather than me start something that someone else will have to deal with the consequences of. I've spoken to a colleague and he's happy to take my handover and caretake for a little while if my replacement hasnt been found by end Dec. Plus technically now is a good time to find new talent as people's contracts often end mid Dec effectively but most hiring managers are more thinking Xmas party than recruitment so good talent and little competition.

thebrexitunicorn

If you’re a union member have you spoken to your rep?