Connection time issue for delay repay

kuepper

My 0822 train was supposed to arrive at 0854 to catch a 0913 connecting train at Manchester Piccadilly.When I got to my departure station I discovered the 0822 had been cancelled and the next train was 0852 which meant I'd miss that connection.

 I had an advance single for those specific Northern Railway Co trains so I asked the ticket desk what was the time of the next connecting train I could legally get with my ticket and was told 0951. When I checked that was actually a TPE train but I assumed it must be allowed because of the disruption. 

I submitted a delay repay claim which was rejected because Northern claim as my originating train arrived at 0924 I could have caught the 0928 train to my destination in which case my delay wouldn't qualify as it was too short.

There was no 0928 from Manchester Piccadilly to my destination as far as I knew and I'd been told my next available connecting train was 0951 by Northern's own staff anyway. Even if there was an 0928 and I'd known about it I doubt if I'd been able to catch it as I first had to disembark from a standing room only rear carriage at platform 1 with a 20kg suitcase and backpack, walk down platform 1, wait to go through the ticket barriers and retrieve my ticket, be stopped by staff to have my ticket checked en route to get access to the connecting train platform 13, take the crowded travellators to get above platform 13 then lug my luggage down steps or wait for a lift to it. Add the 30 seconds before departure when they close the doors and it would have been impossible even if my originating train had arrived at exactly 0924 (it could equally have arrived at 0924 and 59 seconds).

I can't find any rules for gaps for connecting trains  surely they must exist?

daveyjp

Please provide full details of your journey.

What you booked against what actually happened.

There is a minimum connection time of 10 minutes at Manchester Piccadilly.

kuepper

daveyjp said:

Please provide full details of your journey.

What you booked against what actually happened.

There is a minimum connection time of 10 minutes at Manchester Piccadilly.

I think I have provided all the relevant info, what's missing? What's the source of your info re 10 minutes min connection time at Manchester Piccadilly so I can quote it please?

spenderdave

Although you have supplied most of the important information we could help further if we knew:
Date and starting time. Start and end destinations.
Each station has a minimum connection time for changes, four minutes at a busy station like Manchester Piccadilly seems far too short. Not sure if there is a website telling these figures but they exist and are used by journey planners.
All the information on what trains run and delays and cancellations is publicly available from various sources and can be used for your challenge. You could check yourself at http://realtimetrains.co.uk/ for instance.

kuepper

That link was useful, the 0928 train Northern quote was actually the delayed 0926 train which was a TPE train not a Northern one.  Like the 0951 I wasn't sure if I was allowed to get it even if I'd known about it and been able to catch it.

My advanced single ticket was for 14 September 2021 and specified 0822 Northern train Glossop to Manchester Piccadilly then 0913 Northern train Manchester Piccadilly to Manchester Airport. I was told by Northern ticket staff at Glossop that because of the cancellation of the 0822 the next train I could get was 0852 and the revised connection in Manchester Piccadilly was the 0951 to Manchester Airport. When I looked at the departure board at Manchester Piccadilly the next train to Manchester Airport was in fact a delayed Northern train to Crewe that left at 0945 arriving at Manchester Airport at 1004 - >30 minutes later than my ticket was supposed to get me there by.

kuepper

Appeal successful, thanks for replies