Foreign & UK pension advice

Deanbark

Interesting, we married after she made her inquiry. I wonder if that may change her status regarding a pension.

[Deleted User]

SomeMadeUpName said:

@Deanbark, yes I believe there is a minimum number of NI year paid before you qualify for any UK SP. To stop the admin on paying out really small pensions I would imagine.
The question though is could she pay voluntary NI in order to pass that 5 year mark, and also boost it up further.  If she could it would be great value.
@nigelbb has implied she can, I suspect though that he didn't notice from the OP that she was German, and has given her the rights of a UK citizen working/living expat.  I stand to be corrected though, which is why I wondered if she may have gained those rights by marriage or work history in UK.

Nationality is irrelevant. Marriage - ditto.  The fact she has a National Insurance number is one and only thing that matters in this context. 

[Deleted User]

Deanbark said:

 Her existing German company private pension I believe was frozen for the time she was away. Again I am confused why this had to be done. I would have thought she could have continued paying into her existing German fund after all it's the same company.

Regarding the state pension, she was advised some years ago by an advisor that she is not eligible for any sort of UK pension as the minimum time needed is 5 years of National Insurance contributions. I have no idea if this is correct.

1. She couldn’t contribute to the German pension because she wasn’t a German resident for taxation purposes.

2. Paying into the British company pension was the right thing to do. 

3. The advisor was wrong - assuming you are quoting him correctly. 

SomeMadeUpName

Deleted_User said:

Deanbark said:

 Her existing German company private pension I believe was frozen for the time she was away. Again I am confused why this had to be done. I would have thought she could have continued paying into her existing German fund after all it's the same company.

Regarding the state pension, she was advised some years ago by an advisor that she is not eligible for any sort of UK pension as the minimum time needed is 5 years of National Insurance contributions. I have no idea if this is correct.

3. The advisor was wrong - assuming you are quoting him correctly. 

Really? Looking at the web it says the New State Pension needs a minimum of 10years contribs before anything is paid, and it does seem to ring a bell with me that under the old system it was 5 years.

SomeMadeUpName

Deleted_User said:

SomeMadeUpName said:

@Deanbark, yes I believe there is a minimum number of NI year paid before you qualify for any UK SP. To stop the admin on paying out really small pensions I would imagine.
The question though is could she pay voluntary NI in order to pass that 5 year mark, and also boost it up further.  If she could it would be great value.
@nigelbb has implied she can, I suspect though that he didn't notice from the OP that she was German, and has given her the rights of a UK citizen working/living expat.  I stand to be corrected though, which is why I wondered if she may have gained those rights by marriage or work history in UK.

Nationality is irrelevant. Marriage - ditto.  The fact she has a National Insurance number is one and only thing that matters in this context. 

Not according to the Gov website, it lists those eligible to pay voluntary contribs as:

Who can pay voluntary contributions

These tables explain who’s eligible to pay Class 2 or Class 3 contributions.

Your situation	Which class to pay
Employed but earning under £120 a week and not eligible for National Insurance credits	Class 3
Self-employed with profits under £6,515	Class 2 or Class 3 - they count towards different benefits
Both employed and self-employed, with low earnings and small profits	Contact HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) to check if you have a gap and how much you need to pay
Self-employed as an examiner, minister of religion or in an investment or land and property business	Class 2 or Class 3 - they count towards different benefits
Living and working abroad	Class 2 - but only if you worked in the UK immediately before leaving, and you’ve previously lived in the UK for at least 3 years in a row or paid at least 3 years of contributions
Living abroad but not working	Class 3 - but only if at some point you’ve lived in the UK for at least 3 years in a row or paid at least 3 years of contributions
Unemployed and not claiming benefits	Class 3
Married woman or widow who stopped paying reduced rates	Class 3

So it would be quite possible to have an NI number (after say working in UK for 2 years) and then not be able to pay either class of voluntary contrib if you moved abroad (whether you were from UK or elsewhere originally) it would seem.

SomeMadeUpName

Back to whether the OP's wife can buy years though:

It looks like maybe she can, if she worked in the UK for 3.5yrs then she should qualify.  The table doesn't explicitly say non UK citizens can pay, but neither does it say they can't.

SomeMadeUpName

I'm going to try and find out.  I have a lot of international contacts/friends due to work, Spaniards who used to live and work in London, Poles currently working in UK, Brits now working in France and Spain, etc etc.  It would be great to know for sure who can/can't do this. 

bostonerimus

Here is the HMRC document that will tell you whether you or your wife can make voluntary NI contributions.
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/947544/NI38_12_20.pdf
FYI if either of you qualify to pay Class 2, do it! because it's a fantastic deal. I've been paying Class 2 for just over 30 years and it's the best financial move I ever made.
I would also look at the UK/Germany reciprocal social security agreement and see if payments into the German system can be used to top up UK contributions so you qualify for some UK state pension...it will probably be small though.

[Deleted User]

SomeMadeUpName said:

Deleted_User said:

Deanbark said:

 Her existing German company private pension I believe was frozen for the time she was away. Again I am confused why this had to be done. I would have thought she could have continued paying into her existing German fund after all it's the same company.

Regarding the state pension, she was advised some years ago by an advisor that she is not eligible for any sort of UK pension as the minimum time needed is 5 years of National Insurance contributions. I have no idea if this is correct.

3. The advisor was wrong - assuming you are quoting him correctly. 

Really? Looking at the web it says the New State Pension needs a minimum of 10years contribs before anything is paid, and it does seem to ring a bell with me that under the old system it was 5 years.

Yes, you need a minimum of 10 years contributions but the point is that his wife can contribute after leaving Britain and receive the pension. And unless the IFA made that clear, he was giving the wrong information; the exact opposite of helpful 

[Deleted User]

SomeMadeUpName said:

Deleted_User said:

SomeMadeUpName said:

@Deanbark, yes I believe there is a minimum number of NI year paid before you qualify for any UK SP. To stop the admin on paying out really small pensions I would imagine.
The question though is could she pay voluntary NI in order to pass that 5 year mark, and also boost it up further.  If she could it would be great value.
@nigelbb has implied she can, I suspect though that he didn't notice from the OP that she was German, and has given her the rights of a UK citizen working/living expat.  I stand to be corrected though, which is why I wondered if she may have gained those rights by marriage or work history in UK.

Nationality is irrelevant. Marriage - ditto.  The fact she has a National Insurance number is one and only thing that matters in this context. 

Not according to the Gov website, it lists those eligible to pay voluntary contribs as:

Who can pay voluntary contributions

These tables explain who’s eligible to pay Class 2 or Class 3 contributions.

Your situation	Which class to pay
Employed but earning under £120 a week and not eligible for National Insurance credits	Class 3
Self-employed with profits under £6,515	Class 2 or Class 3 - they count towards different benefits
Both employed and self-employed, with low earnings and small profits	Contact HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) to check if you have a gap and how much you need to pay
Self-employed as an examiner, minister of religion or in an investment or land and property business	Class 2 or Class 3 - they count towards different benefits
Living and working abroad	Class 2 - but only if you worked in the UK immediately before leaving, and you’ve previously lived in the UK for at least 3 years in a row or paid at least 3 years of contributions
Living abroad but not working	Class 3 - but only if at some point you’ve lived in the UK for at least 3 years in a row or paid at least 3 years of contributionst
Unemployed and not claiming benefits	Class 3
Married woman or widow who stopped paying reduced rates	Class 3

So it would be quite possible to have an NI number (after say working in UK for 2 years) and then not be able to pay either class of voluntary contrib if you moved abroad (whether you were from UK or elsewhere originally) it would seem.

Fair enough, there is a 3 year residency requirement but citizenship or marital status are irrelevant.