Surprisingly US citizen

Cook_County

Most folks would use the official penalty-free IRS Streamlined Foreign Offshore Procedures (SFOP) as the lowest risk and lowest cost way of catching up. https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/u-s-taxpayers-residing-outside-the-united-states

Sandtree

Scamp247 said:
I discovered that I am apparently still a US citizen. I was born in the US in 1966 to British parents and have lived in the UK since being 2 weeks old. Although having a US passport at birth to return to UK

So when, and by what mechanism, did you think you gave up your US citizenship?

EdSwippet

Sandtree said:

Scamp247 said:
I discovered that I am apparently still a US citizen. I was born in the US in 1966 to British parents and have lived in the UK since being 2 weeks old. Although having a US passport at birth to return to UK

So when, and by what mechanism, did you think you gave up your US citizenship?

To be fair, I think the surprise is less about being a US citizen than it is about the US demanding full income tax annually on worldwide income from somebody who hasn't lived there for well over half a century.

The US is virtually unique in this respect. Most people not intimately acquainted with the horror that is the US tax code would have no suspicion that it treats its expat citizens in this restrictive, spiteful and controlling manner.

Jeremy535897

EdSwippet said:

Sandtree said:

Scamp247 said:
I discovered that I am apparently still a US citizen. I was born in the US in 1966 to British parents and have lived in the UK since being 2 weeks old. Although having a US passport at birth to return to UK

So when, and by what mechanism, did you think you gave up your US citizenship?

To be fair, I think the surprise is less about being a US citizen than it is about the US demanding full income tax annually on worldwide income from somebody who hasn't lived there for well over half a century.

The US is virtually unique in this respect. Most people not intimately acquainted with the horror that is the US tax code would have no suspicion that it treats its expat citizens in this restrictive, spiteful and controlling manner.

It is the combination of the US taxing its citizens on their worldwide income, and article 4 of the US-UK double tax agreement, which permits the US to ignore most of the provisions of the agreement when its citizens are involved, although the provision for double taxation relief should limit the total tax paid to the higher amount payable under the two systems.

planckfund

Cook_County said:

Most folks would use the official penalty-free IRS Streamlined Foreign Offshore Procedures (SFOP) as the lowest risk and lowest cost way of catching up. https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/u-s-taxpayers-residing-outside-the-united-states

What incentive is there to do so unless you plan to live or work or have some US income stream or assets?

Jeremy535897

planckfund said:

Cook_County said:

Most folks would use the official penalty-free IRS Streamlined Foreign Offshore Procedures (SFOP) as the lowest risk and lowest cost way of catching up. https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/u-s-taxpayers-residing-outside-the-united-states

What incentive is there to do so unless you plan to live or work or have some US income stream or assets?

You might want the coronavirus support, or just want to have a holiday there.

planckfund

Good point but you don't need a US passport to have a US holiday and you will quickly find your coronavirus support frittered away on US tax specialists. There are many things which are taxable in the states and not here.....  I'd suggest wait for them to tell you that you're a US citizen ..

EdSwippet

planckfund said:

Good point but you don't need a US passport to have a US holiday ...

Strictly, you do if you're a US citizen:
https://uk.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/u-s-passports/u-s-passport-faqs/u-s-citizenship/

I am a U.S. citizen, but also have a foreign passport. Can I travel to the United States on the foreign passport?
No. U.S. citizens must enter and leave the United States on valid U.S. passports, even if they hold a passport from another country. If your U.S. passport has been lost or stolen, or if it has expired, you must apply to replace it before traveling to the United States.

As for

planckfund said:

...  I'd suggest wait for them to tell you that you're a US citizen.

That's not really in doubt. And if any such communication comes, it might arrive in the form of an IRS non-filing penalty running to multiple tens of thousands of dollars.

Some folk are happy to run that risk, not least because the risk is perhaps moderate, and even if it materialises the IRS has no real ability to collect unpaid penalties from non-US accounts. But, the risk is there. And if you are delinquent enough on your US taxes, the US may refuse to issue you with a US passport.

planckfund

The Dept of State is wrong I humbly suggest but the issue for most people isn't the holiday to the US --- it's the being hounded to file tax returns and unjustly pay US taxes on UK scholarships or court awards or pensions and property transactions and have bank account access blocked because of their presumed 'citizenship'.

However, I really would like to know:

1. Has there ever been a case of someone being refused access to the US with a valid UK passport because they should have had come in on a US passport because they were 'accidentally' US citizens. I certainly know people who've done this, many times.
2. Has there ever been a case of an accidental American citizen being hit with any IRS tax demand or penalty at all, who has never been resident in the US, has no Social Security number, no assets or income in the US and has never worked there? They clearly don't waste their time chasing people who have no money and aren't evading tax.
3. The US is a weird country that constantly makes and breaks its own rules. Are you really saying that a US citizen arriving at the US border with proof of citizenship  such birth certificates etc. would be denied entry? Has this ever happened? I'm sure they would make it difficult but I don't believe they can ever legally prevent you entering the country. this is a country that can't prevent you from being a dual national after all.

I really would like some hard evidence rather than dire warnings. 

My advice is meant for people who are not wealthy and feel bewildered by categorical statements such yours when the reality is much more nuanced and has been so for many, many years.....  It will certainly cost you 1,000's of dollars attempting to comply with the IRS or to renounce your citizenship,  so I would say don't bother until you really have to-----and that's not now. The wealthy, like Boris Johnson will follow the advice of their lawyers, and of course he only renounced his citizenship when he absolutely had to. The rest of us should just stop worrying. My considered opinion. Tell the the bank you're a UK citizen so they don't have anything to report to the US authorities. They don't care. Neither should you. You're not who they're after.

EdSwippet

planckfund said:

The Dept of State is wrong I humbly suggest ...

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1185

(b)Citizens

Except as otherwise provided by the President and subject to such limitations and exceptions as the President may authorize and prescribe, it shall be unlawful for any citizen of the United States to depart from or enter, or attempt to depart from or enter, the United States unless he bears a valid United States passport.