ROYAL INSURANCE - Legacy Mortgage hold...desperately need help hunting down a good contact!

Hinch71

Hi folks, I really hope someone who reads this can help.  
Sadly, my mum passed away last year and we're now having to manage her estate. My dad died almost 40 years ago in a car accident, very unexpectedly as you can imagine. At the time, he worked for Royal Insurance in quite a senior role, and we'd only fairly recently moved to the house were were living in after moving several hundred miles following his promotion to that new position. He must have had some sort of endowment policy as the mortgage was settled in full as a result of his untimely death.

Roll forwards 40 years, and it turns out Royal Insurance still have a claim on the deeds for mum's house! (sorry I'm not sure of the correct term) We've pieced together from the deeds that Royal Insurance must have effectively bought the house initially, until my parents had sold their old one and were able to officially buy the new property at which point the deeds were transferred to my parents names. But for some reason Royal Insurance's claim was never removed from the mortgage.

The challenge is that Royal Insurance don't exist anymore! And neither RSA or Phoenix (who I've already tried) can be of much help. This is a very non-standard query after all! I don't believe Royal Insurance were ever a mortgage provider?... this was perhaps a very individual arrangement by them as my dad's employer to help him move to the new location until he'd sold our old house. And the helplines I call are all about life policies and pensions, and understandably the Advisors I speak to haven't got a clue how to help.

Can anyone either suggest how I can find the right person to talk to, or suggest another route to take? I'm wondering if there's a process where we can challenge the situation with the Land Registry themselves perhaps??? Mum's house is in Scotland, if that information is helpful.

Sorry for long post, I hope someone can help. As you can imagine, this is adding further stress to an already emotional time.

Thanks :-)

MovingForwards

People on the pensions board are a dab hand at tracking down old finance companies.

You would be best off confirming the old Royal Insurance address in your post as that may be needed to help find where they ended up. It will be on the title deeds, a copy can be obtained from Registers of Scotland (land registry covers England and Wales).

davidmcn

Do you have the full name and address from one of the deeds, as I suspect there'll have been more than one "Royal Insurance" over the years?

You can't "challenge the situation" with the Land Register, they'll need a signed Discharge deed from whoever took over Royal Insurance.

Old_Lifer

Your mother would presumably  have been receiving a widows pension from the Royal  Life             Staff Pension Scheme following the death in service of your father and this should appear on bank statements

I am a former employee of a Life Office myself and receive regular communications from  the Pensioners Association a couple of times a year giving details of those who have retired and died recently.    If your mother has been receiving similar communications the Pensioners Assiciation should be able to help.

Some  Life Officies did offer mortgages  40 years ago   and even those  which didn't  would probably have provided staff mortgages on an endowment basis.

Hinch71

Hi everyone, thanks so much for your replies! Yes @Old_Lifer she did receive a widows pension. That was fairly easy to track down tbh, as it was managed through RSA and I guess it's not such a rare occurrence for an ex Royal Insurance person to pop their clogs! They didn't bat an eyelid when I called them, and I had the reference number from her direct debit which was a big help. Do you think it's worth me speaking to the pensions team at RSA and asking if they can shed any light on this?? I can't see that a Pension and a Mortgage would be linked in any way though?

Thanks for suggesting I share the address that was used on the deeds @MovingForwards and @davidmcn... It states the Registered Office address of One North John Street, Liverpool.

Good idea re me posting this request for help on the pensions forum too... although the pension side is all sorted now, and we've got Confirmation (Scottish version of Probate I believe!). It's literally just the house sale now, and obviously we can't do that until this is resolved... 

Thanks again :-)

MovingForwards

A quick search shows it merged with RSA, so yes, go back to them with as much information as you have and see what they say.

I suggested posting on the pensions board, not to help with pensions, but because there's some older members who know how to trace companies / departments and tell people where they need to contact and what information to provide to get the query resolved.

Old_Lifer

If there is a Pensioners Association,   some members may remember your father  and since death in service is not a common thing, some who worked with him or handled the case may remember what happened at the time.

Hinch71

MovingForwards said:

A quick search shows it merged with RSA, so yes, go back to them with as much information as you have and see what they say.

I suggested posting on the pensions board, not to help with pensions, but because there's some older members who know how to trace companies / departments and tell people where they need to contact and what information to provide to get the query resolved.

Thanks MovingForwards! I have a similar thread now going on the pensions board, and you were right they are very helpful (as are those of you here!). It’s just as well I like a challenge, as this doesn’t look as though it’ll be sorted easily or quickly. And yes, we’ll go back to RSA and keep encouraging that angle too.

Hinch71

Old_Lifer said:

If there is a Pensioners Association,   some members may remember your father  and since death in service is not a common thing, some who worked with him or handled the case may remember what happened at the time.

Yes good idea! It was a very sudden death and he was very fondly thought of by the people he worked with at the time. So you’re right, someone might remember! Thanks - now to look for a Royal Insurance Pensioners Association!! :-)

Old_Lifer

If you can find no documentation yourself,  RSA may be able to give you a contact number  of the Pensioners Association. 

In my own case,  I receive regular lists of  Association officials (all retired former employees themselves) with contact numbers, some of whom have national functions and some regional.

If you provide  a  Pensioners  Association with details of your father  (his name,  name of company at the time,  dates and  branch locations  before and after the move)  they may be able to provide an explanation of what happened at the time.