Losing out on holiday pay

roseview

My husband and I both work on a tactical basis for some companies. With a couple of them their holiday policy states that we cannot claim less than half a day holiday pay, yet we don't always earn that entitlement in a year due to the small amount of work that we do for them. As such, that means that we don't get the holiday pay. Can they really do this? Surely, we are entitled to it by law? It's not a lot of money but that's not the point, it's the principle.

General_Grant

So you work fewer than a total of about 31 hours in a year for each of the companies in question?

oh_really

Are you self employed (contractor), or are you an employee?

Brynsam

roseview said:

My husband and I both work on a tactical basis for some companies. With a couple of them their holiday policy states that we cannot claim less than half a day holiday pay, yet we don't always earn that entitlement in a year due to the small amount of work that we do for them. As such, that means that we don't get the holiday pay. Can they really do this? Surely, we are entitled to it by law? It's not a lot of money but that's not the point, it's the principle.

Never get carried away by principles - always look at the hard reality. It's a real faff for a company to administer holiday pay where someone works for a tiny, erratic number of hours each year. Rather than presenting them with a problem (in which case they might find you too much trouble to employ, even on a casual basis), what practical compromise can you suggest to them? Look at your history of working hours in the last 3 years - would suggesting that they agree half a day a year look sensible, on that basis? Alternatively, would they agree to increase your hourly rate by a  very modest sum to cover holiday pay?

roseview

General_Grant said:

So you work fewer than a total of about 31 hours in a year for each of the companies in question?

That's often the case when you work for multiple companies on a tactical basis. WIth this particular company I'm a new starter so no chance to do more hours this year.

Brynsam said:

roseview said:

My husband and I both work on a tactical basis for some companies. With a couple of them their holiday policy states that we cannot claim less than half a day holiday pay, yet we don't always earn that entitlement in a year due to the small amount of work that we do for them. As such, that means that we don't get the holiday pay. Can they really do this? Surely, we are entitled to it by law? It's not a lot of money but that's not the point, it's the principle.

Never get carried away by principles - always look at the hard reality. It's a real faff for a company to administer holiday pay where someone works for a tiny, erratic number of hours each year. Rather than presenting them with a problem (in which case they might find you too much trouble to employ, even on a casual basis), what practical compromise can you suggest to them? Look at your history of working hours in the last 3 years - would suggesting that they agree half a day a year look sensible, on that basis? Alternatively, would they agree to increase your hourly rate by a  very modest sum to cover holiday pay?

As yet I've not gone back to them but I did do so for my husband a few years back and eventually they paid him half a day but weren't too happy about it. I realise that it's a bit of a faff but as I am paid hourly, I don't see why it would be too hard to pay me the accrued hours.

I was hoping that somebody could tell me if they are legally allowed to do this before I go back to them.

oh_really said:

Are you self employed (contractor), or are you an employee?

I am employed but it's worker (limb (b) status) I think.

Thrugelmir

Holiday days will be rounded for all other employees as well if that's the policy. Companies rarely faff about with hours , either half or full days rounded down in the main. 

General_Grant

Legally you are entitled to paid leave equal to 12.069% of the hours worked.  They can round the time up but not down.  So you would be entitled to half a day's holiday if they insist on only paying in multiples of half days and you don't work enough hours to qualify for even half a day on the percentage basis.

getmore4less

roseview said:

My husband and I both work on a tactical basis for some companies. With a couple of them their holiday policy states that we cannot claim less than half a day holiday pay, yet we don't always earn that entitlement in a year due to the small amount of work that we do for them. As such, that means that we don't get the holiday pay. Can they really do this? Surely, we are entitled to it by law? It's not a lot of money but that's not the point, it's the principle.

What is a 1/2 day?

Probably not what they are telling you.
For a one hour a day worker it is 1/2 hour. 

They probably mean a min hours payment not 1/2 day. 

Holiday is defined by weeks(not days) and holiday pay is now(since April) determined by reference to the previous 52 weeks.

They need to pay holiday pay.
 if they want to round that up that is their option.
they can't round down. 

Rolled up pay may be the best option, if work is very sparse, included in each pay period rather than actually taking holiday. 

General_Grant

getmore4less said:

roseview said:

My husband and I both work on a tactical basis for some companies. With a couple of them their holiday policy states that we cannot claim less than half a day holiday pay, yet we don't always earn that entitlement in a year due to the small amount of work that we do for them. As such, that means that we don't get the holiday pay. Can they really do this? Surely, we are entitled to it by law? It's not a lot of money but that's not the point, it's the principle.

What is a 1/2 day?

Probably not what they are telling you.
For a one hour a day worker it is 1/2 hour. 

They probably mean a min hours payment not 1/2 day. 

Holiday is defined by weeks(not days) and holiday pay is now(since April) determined by reference to the previous 52 weeks.

They need to pay holiday pay.
 if they want to round that up that is their option.
they can't round down. 

Rolled up pay may be the best option, if work is very sparse, included in each pay period rather than actually taking holiday. 

Rolled up holiday pay (that is where holiday pay is rolled up in the hourly rate paid) is not lawful.  Pay for holiday included in  the payment each pay period has to be shown separately from the basic hourly rate.

Savvy_Sue

General_Grant said:

getmore4less said:

Rolled up pay may be the best option, if work is very sparse, included in each pay period rather than actually taking holiday. 

Rolled up holiday pay (that is where holiday pay is rolled up in the hourly rate paid) is not lawful.  Pay for holiday included in  the payment each pay period has to be shown separately from the basic hourly rate.

In summary, paying it each period but showing it separately is the best solution: rolled up would be showing a higher rate which included holiday pay without showing it separately. 

roseview

Many of the companies that we work for do actually pay 'rolled up' holiday pay, even though they aren't supposed to.