Chased for school fee debt

KatieBW123

Can anyone advise please. My now 19 year old son had attended an independent school for 11 years but in his first GCSE year, things started to go really wrong in terms of his behaviour and academic performance. He was being routinely punished through detentions and suspensions to the point where he was one suspension away from expulsion. He had experienced years of his father continually taking me to the family court and it felt to me like everything was impacting at once. Many of his infractions were to do with disorganisation and time-keeping, rather than REALLY bad stuff and I felt that his new senior year teacher didn't really 'get' him, so he had little pastoral support. This time 4 years ago, when he had just turned 15, I went to school to meet with the head and deputy head in what would be my final meeting with them and when my son felt very close to the end of the line. 

I had an overwhelming feeling in the meeting that they were 'done' with my son, there appeared to be no strategy beyond more punishment and no consideration towards what I believed were the deeper underlying causes of his behaviour. I pointed out that his essay scaffolding appeared to be very poor and the head asked if I had "thought about a learning difficulty" and we agreed that my son would be tested for any SEN. I left the meeting feeling very dejected and unsupported and that, without a shift in attitude around my son, he was inevitably about to be expelled. 

Maybe a week later, sen test results confirmed my son had slow processing and I believed this would've accounted for some of his struggle as he clearly had additional educational support requirements that hadn't been met. 

This is almost exactly 4 years ago. I had a panic to find another school as few had entry through GCSE year. I felt that had no option but to pull him out fast, there had been no further contact from the teachers or the head following the meeting or the sen results, I felt my son had been really let down and he started at another school straight after Christmas. I had not given a terms notice to the previous school and when they sent me an invoice in the January, I emailed back to inform the bursar that he had left. 

In the time since, I have heard nothing from the school and had no correspondence from them.  I have moved house but had post forwarded and anyway my usual communication had been via email. (My son is now at uni, once his sen had been realised provisions could be made and he eventually got back on track). 

I realised I had been obliged to give a terms notice but actually had felt boxed into a corner and that expulsion was imminent. As so many years have passed and having not heard anything, I have naively - stupidly? - assumed the school felt vaguely complicit and realised I had been left with very few options. That the notice period was null and void. This is largely based on my never having heard from them again. I had already been struggling with fees, my sons father had constantly reneged on a court order we had signed to pay 50% each. I had supported myself by self-employment but early last year, had to liquidate my limited company and close my business, I have earned very little since and have no assets. 

Yesterday I received a letter from a collections agency stating the school as their client. This is nearly 4 years later and with no prior notice. I have not managed to speak to either the collections or the school but can anyone advise re my position on this? 1. I do not have the money to pay the bill at all (my financial circumstances are much changed for the worse) 2. I believe that my sons father may have co-signed the original school documentation so therefore would be severally liable wouldn’t he? 3. Do I have any right to appeal, based on the circumstances above and also the fact I have never received ANY notification re pursuing me? If I had, I could've stated my case, inc the schools failings towards its duty of care OR could've negotiated payment. This has come out of the blue and been a real shock to my system today, would really appreciate any advice, thank you. 

Update: I have now received more substantial info from the collections agency, a “letter of claim” for the total terms fees inc interest accrued since. Should I contact the bursar or have they sold the debt on? When I look up this agency, they seem to specialise in getting fees back on behalf of schools.

elsien

@sourcrates, can you help with the debt side of this? 

soolin

Apologies this was lurking on the England money saving forum where it wasn’t seen . It’s probably too late now for any meaningful help but I’ve moved it anyway. 

tacpot12

As you have little income and no assets, the debt recovery process is going to be relatively straightforward. It would be best to come to an arrangement to pay as soon as you can to avoid further debt collection fees being added to the cost. You might try asking the school to waive the interest.

You can tell the debt collection company that you think the father is jointly and severally liable. If they want to pursue this they can check it with the school, but as you are liable, if they pursue you, you should try to pay what you can.

Are you claiming all the benefits you can? You can use the calculator at entitledto.co.uk to check this. If you  can get more income, it will help clear this debt more quickly. Equally if you can same money on your out goings it will help. If you post a Statement of Affairs (SoA) here, it will be possible to help you see where there is scope to reduce your costs. There is a tool to help you create a Statement of Affairs here -> SOA Calculator (stoozing.com)   If you use the tool, you can paste the output of it in reply to your original post. 

fatbelly

1. I do not have the money to pay the bill at all (my financial circumstances are much changed for the worse) 2. I believe that my sons father may have co-signed the original school documentation so therefore would be severally liable wouldn’t he? 3. Do I have any right to appeal, based on the circumstances above and also the fact I have never received ANY notification re pursuing me? If I had, I could've stated my case, inc the schools failings towards its duty of care OR could've negotiated payment. 

OK, it's unlikely that the agency has bought the debt - if they have they should be making it clear. If not, they are probably still referring to the schools as 'our client'

On your point 2, yes that's true. But joint and several liability means they can pursue either or both party for the full amount. It's not a 50/50 split.

On your point 3, that's too specialised an area for me. Have a look at the school's website and any of their publications to see if they are affiliated to any organisation to whom you could appeal. Obviously if there is, you should.

As you are clearly not accepting that you are liable for the figure they are quoting (and I would want to see it in writing if they are charging interest and any collection fees that they are allowed to do this) then I would not recommend that you pay them anything at the moment as this will make it more difficult to argue that you dispute the figures.

A court is the last resort for settling disputes like this and it seems a little odd that this has not been considered earlier. They have six years from when the debt arose to start a court claim, provided that you do not acknowledge the debt by payment or in writing. You can't acknowledge a debt by phone.

Finally, for now, if you have been sent a formal letter before action, on the standard form, then this is how to respond

https://debtcamel.co.uk/letter-before-claim-ccj/

and you could benefit from a chat with National Debtline https://www.nationaldebtline.org/ - this one, not the sharks who impersonate them

groovy_chick

I personally would be very tempted to contact the Head to discuss a refund for the years of fees that you did pay, for educators that did not identify your son's learning difficulty.  Would they still want to pursue you for the final terms fees if you said you thought other parents should be made aware that the school is failing at identifying educational needs?  Surely an Independent school should be providing the kind of individual coaching to pick up on this in his early Secondary years?

When my husband left me, our children were in Private School and I had to remove them as soon as his financial support dried up - the Bursar was a cold-hearted and merciless man, who threatened to exclude my children on the day of their Christmas play because we were behind with our fees by a matter of days.  The Bursar is focused on one thing; bringing money in, whilst the Head has the reputation of the school to maintain - this is who you should put your case to.

Can I just say that I am so glad your son has received the support he needs and has made it to Uni, that is great!  Good luck in putting things right with the school.

GC x

Matt8888

groovy_chick said:

I personally would be very tempted to contact the Head to discuss a refund for the years of fees that you did pay, for educators that did not identify your son's learning difficulty.  Would they still want to pursue you for the final terms fees if you said you thought other parents should be made aware that the school is failing at identifying educational needs?  Surely an Independent school should be providing the kind of individual coaching to pick up on this in his early Secondary years?

When my husband left me, our children were in Private School and I had to remove them as soon as his financial support dried up - the Bursar was a cold-hearted and merciless man, who threatened to exclude my children on the day of their Christmas play because we were behind with our fees by a matter of days.  The Bursar is focused on one thing; bringing money in, whilst the Head has the reputation of the school to maintain - this is who you should put your case to.

Can I just say that I am so glad your son has received the support he needs and has made it to Uni, that is great!  Good luck in putting things right with the school.

GC x

Of course the bursar is focused on bringing the money in. That is his job! And if he didn't do it, there would end up being no school. As for getting the fees refunded, dream on... And do please remember that we have only heard the details of these events from the OP. You can bet your bottom dollar that the school would have a very different version of events, and I would not be so quick to assume the parent is in the right and the school is in the wrong without any evidence. Schools have a very difficult job (both state and independent), and have to contend with more and more sniping and disrespect from "Mumsnet Warriors" who know it all...

theoretica

From the timing, I wonder if the school is in financial trouble and looking through past accounts for any money they can chase.  Persuade them you are not a source of money and maybe they will go quiet.

TheAble

So you're liable for one term's worth of fees, is that right? And there is a court order in place making your ex 50% liable? 

Exodi

TheAble said:

So you're liable for one term's worth of fees, is that right? And there is a court order in place making your ex 50% liable? 

From re-reading, I interpret it that the ex-parent and the OP co-signed the original school application/documentation.

I think it might be a bit of a stretch to claim the ex is liable for this cost - they'd likely argue that your negligence to provide the school contractual notice was not their fault. Personally I'd side with that view somewhat.

Even if you could claim they are liable for your mistake, you'd still be liable fo 100% of the debt.

fatbelly

That's the way I read it too. But joint and several liability means that they can go after either or both for the full amount.