Training to be a Mortgage advisor

Tayshuwi

Hi, I'm looking to do CeMAP and achieve CAS. I have a teaching background and also since 2016 have set up my own window cleaning business. The cleaning has done well and now brings in enough to live on. I find teaching stressful and am looking to minimise my exposure to this. I've always been interested in financial services and have read around the subject for years.
Does anyone have advise of training and setting up independently? My dream would be to be a IMA and even give my children the opportunity of joining me as a family brokerage.
Should I go straight to being independent or go with a brokerage first? I've had an offer to be trained and work self-employed by one brokerage on a 65% commission. I would employ others to be hands on with the cleaning business and keep that going.

Thanks for you insights

JB

Marcon

If you go 'straight to being independent' how would you get clients - and why would they come to you rather than a well-established and experienced adviser?

The 'offer' you've had doesn't sound much of an offer - read any small print very carefully indeed since you are likely to find all sorts of things in any 'training' agreement which you might prefer not to see. You also need to be very sure that HMRC will regard this as 'self employed' - they are the ones who need to be satisfied that you are genuinely self employed.

If you've not yet done so, have a look at https://nationalcareers.service.gov.uk/job-profiles/mortgage-adviser

Hope things work out for you - but don't underestimate the level of skill and knowledge clients expect of anyone advising in any area of financial services. 

Edi81

You may want to post on the mortgages board where there are a few brokers that post.
Its been asked a number of times on that board before and its not easy to get established.

haras_n0sirrah

I have been a mortgage broker for 15 years. 12 years in corporate estate agency and 3 as an independent. 
Most mortgage brokers fail within 2 years due to a lack of clients and income. Cemap does not prepare you for the real world of brokering where not everyone is a ftb with straight forward circumstances - most people come to us because their situation is tricky and it takes a lot of time to build up the knowledge to know which lenders will do what (and then covid happens and the rule book goes out the window)

Most brokers come into the industry via estate agency groups as you will get the training and will see plenty of customers. You also have protection against complaints if you make mistakes and a basic salary. Once you know the job, the criteria and are confident in your ability then consider going independent but dont run before you can walk - mistakes will cost you dearly and it is a very stressful industry to be in, especially at the moment where lenders are badly delayed and criteria is changed at a moment's notice. You need to be a problem solver, tenacious, good at relationship building and honest. I got a case decline overturned  yesterday that the underwriter had declined. Put together an appeal and senior underwriter has agreed it. The client could not go elsewhere lender wise so it was that or bust. Never take a first no as an answer. I get a reasonable number of clients approach me from mse as I am active on the mortgage board and nearly all have had mortgage applications go wrong elsewhere first and come to me to sort them out.

You also dont get paid until about 2 months after a mortgage completes so if a house sale takes 3 months to go through then it may take 5 months between seeing a client and getting paid. That is the ones that do complete as chains break and some go nowhere even after putting in a lot of work. You need a lot of capital to get started if going self employed- 12 months living costs as a minimum. 

I am not trying to put you off as if you can make it then the job is very well paid (a 6 figure income if you are really good) but there are many mortgage brokers who earn less than 10k a year and quit. The key is getting customers and to do that you will need a good reputation as someone who knows their stuff. Getting customers is the key to this business and that will determine whether you make it or not 

2020sombre

haras_n0sirrah said:

I have been a mortgage broker for 15 years. 12 years in corporate estate agency and 3 as an independent. 
Most mortgage brokers fail within 2 years due to a lack of clients and income. Cemap does not prepare you for the real world of brokering where not everyone is a ftb with straight forward circumstances - most people come to us because their situation is tricky and it takes a lot of time to build up the knowledge to know which lenders will do what (and then covid happens and the rule book goes out the window)

Most brokers come into the industry via estate agency groups as you will get the training and will see plenty of customers. You also have protection against complaints if you make mistakes and a basic salary. Once you know the job, the criteria and are confident in your ability then consider going independent but dont run before you can walk - mistakes will cost you dearly and it is a very stressful industry to be in, especially at the moment where lenders are badly delayed and criteria is changed at a moment's notice. You need to be a problem solver, tenacious, good at relationship building and honest. I got a case decline overturned  yesterday that the underwriter had declined. Put together an appeal and senior underwriter has agreed it. The client could not go elsewhere lender wise so it was that or bust. Never take a first no as an answer. I get a reasonable number of clients approach me from mse as I am active on the mortgage board and nearly all have had mortgage applications go wrong elsewhere first and come to me to sort them out.

You also dont get paid until about 2 months after a mortgage completes so if a house sale takes 3 months to go through then it may take 5 months between seeing a client and getting paid. That is the ones that do complete as chains break and some go nowhere even after putting in a lot of work. You need a lot of capital to get started if going self employed- 12 months living costs as a minimum. 

I am not trying to put you off as if you can make it then the job is very well paid (a 6 figure income if you are really good) but there are many mortgage brokers who earn less than 10k a year and quit. The key is getting customers and to do that you will need a good reputation as someone who knows their stuff. Getting customers is the key to this business and that will determine whether you make it or not 

Hello your post is quite informative thank you. One question I have is

How in depth does a mortgage advisor go is it solely admin type work such as putting the numbers in the computer, keeping industry up to date and chasing progress, getting a decision in principle after making sure the 'non advice service' is threw in before and during the meeting?

For instance can they recommend developers, life insurance companies sort of like a supermarket one stop shop for buyers etc?

For newly qualified advisors is the salary really around 20 K only

 

MovingForwards

2020sombre said:

haras_n0sirrah said:

I have been a mortgage broker for 15 years. 12 years in corporate estate agency and 3 as an independent. 
Most mortgage brokers fail within 2 years due to a lack of clients and income. Cemap does not prepare you for the real world of brokering where not everyone is a ftb with straight forward circumstances - most people come to us because their situation is tricky and it takes a lot of time to build up the knowledge to know which lenders will do what (and then covid happens and the rule book goes out the window)

Most brokers come into the industry via estate agency groups as you will get the training and will see plenty of customers. You also have protection against complaints if you make mistakes and a basic salary. Once you know the job, the criteria and are confident in your ability then consider going independent but dont run before you can walk - mistakes will cost you dearly and it is a very stressful industry to be in, especially at the moment where lenders are badly delayed and criteria is changed at a moment's notice. You need to be a problem solver, tenacious, good at relationship building and honest. I got a case decline overturned  yesterday that the underwriter had declined. Put together an appeal and senior underwriter has agreed it. The client could not go elsewhere lender wise so it was that or bust. Never take a first no as an answer. I get a reasonable number of clients approach me from mse as I am active on the mortgage board and nearly all have had mortgage applications go wrong elsewhere first and come to me to sort them out.

You also dont get paid until about 2 months after a mortgage completes so if a house sale takes 3 months to go through then it may take 5 months between seeing a client and getting paid. That is the ones that do complete as chains break and some go nowhere even after putting in a lot of work. You need a lot of capital to get started if going self employed- 12 months living costs as a minimum. 

I am not trying to put you off as if you can make it then the job is very well paid (a 6 figure income if you are really good) but there are many mortgage brokers who earn less than 10k a year and quit. The key is getting customers and to do that you will need a good reputation as someone who knows their stuff. Getting customers is the key to this business and that will determine whether you make it or not 

Hello your post is quite informative thank you. One question I have is

How in depth does a mortgage advisor go is it solely admin type work such as putting the numbers in the computer, keeping industry up to date and chasing progress, getting a decision in principle after making sure the 'non advice service' is threw in before and during the meeting?

For instance can they recommend developers, life insurance companies sort of like a supermarket one stop shop for buyers etc?

For newly qualified advisors is the salary really around 20 K only

 

Is that what you think a broker does 2020sombre?

They have to know criteria inside and out, be prepared to forget previous criteria and quickly learn the new one, not for just one lender but usually 80+ lenders, all with their own little quirks. 

They need to have a good understanding of their client and their aims, to make sure they match them to the right lender. They need to understand how underwriters look at what's presented to them so they can try and resolve questions before they are even raised. 

They don't recommend developers.

With life insurance, critical illness insurance and home insurance that's also on an advised basis. So they have to know the criteria to make sure the client fits it; not like us just going on to a comparison site, plugging our details in and picking based on price or because we've heard of the company name.

They have long conversations about why they think X is better than Y, how it matches what the client wants and explain in detail why they say what they do. They work long hours getting the work done and also updating clients, asking for further information, reassuring them, answering questions. I had emails from my broker at 3am and 5am when my application was in, plus during normal office hours.

Any mistake falls on the brokers shoulders, if they made the error.

Have a read over the mortgage board, you will see what brokers say, how they say it and also how members ask additional questions to try and pin point key details.

DCFC79

2020sombre said:

haras_n0sirrah said:

I have been a mortgage broker for 15 years. 12 years in corporate estate agency and 3 as an independent. 
Most mortgage brokers fail within 2 years due to a lack of clients and income. Cemap does not prepare you for the real world of brokering where not everyone is a ftb with straight forward circumstances - most people come to us because their situation is tricky and it takes a lot of time to build up the knowledge to know which lenders will do what (and then covid happens and the rule book goes out the window)

Most brokers come into the industry via estate agency groups as you will get the training and will see plenty of customers. You also have protection against complaints if you make mistakes and a basic salary. Once you know the job, the criteria and are confident in your ability then consider going independent but dont run before you can walk - mistakes will cost you dearly and it is a very stressful industry to be in, especially at the moment where lenders are badly delayed and criteria is changed at a moment's notice. You need to be a problem solver, tenacious, good at relationship building and honest. I got a case decline overturned  yesterday that the underwriter had declined. Put together an appeal and senior underwriter has agreed it. The client could not go elsewhere lender wise so it was that or bust. Never take a first no as an answer. I get a reasonable number of clients approach me from mse as I am active on the mortgage board and nearly all have had mortgage applications go wrong elsewhere first and come to me to sort them out.

You also dont get paid until about 2 months after a mortgage completes so if a house sale takes 3 months to go through then it may take 5 months between seeing a client and getting paid. That is the ones that do complete as chains break and some go nowhere even after putting in a lot of work. You need a lot of capital to get started if going self employed- 12 months living costs as a minimum. 

I am not trying to put you off as if you can make it then the job is very well paid (a 6 figure income if you are really good) but there are many mortgage brokers who earn less than 10k a year and quit. The key is getting customers and to do that you will need a good reputation as someone who knows their stuff. Getting customers is the key to this business and that will determine whether you make it or not 

Hello your post is quite informative thank you. One question I have is

How in depth does a mortgage advisor go is it solely admin type work such as putting the numbers in the computer, keeping industry up to date and chasing progress, getting a decision in principle after making sure the 'non advice service' is threw in before and during the meeting?

For instance can they recommend developers, life insurance companies sort of like a supermarket one stop shop for buyers etc?

For newly qualified advisors is the salary really around 20 K only

 

Im hoping your not expecting a response from the poster you quoted, they are banned but it looks like you have received some good advice anyway.

ACG

2020sombre said:

Hello your post is quite informative thank you. One question I have is

How in depth does a mortgage advisor go is it solely admin type work such as putting the numbers in the computer, keeping industry up to date and chasing progress, getting a decision in principle after making sure the 'non advice service' is threw in before and during the meeting?

For instance can they recommend developers, life insurance companies sort of like a supermarket one stop shop for buyers etc?

For newly qualified advisors is the salary really around 20 K only

 

I echo what haras has said. The exam is a bit of a joke really and not worth anything in the real world.

To give you an idea, I have a quick chat with customers to get a few basic details. I then get a factfind completed which is around 8 pages of information. I also get a copy of bank statements, payslips and credit reports. 

We then cross reference all of the documents in the first instance to ensure what the customer has told us is correct - I would say about 30-50% of the time, customers mange to forget something that can affect getting a mortgage. 

It is not just a case of plugging in the purchase price, loan amount and term and seeing what comes up. You can do that on a price comparison site, you dont need a broker for that. 

What happens if the customer has been in their job for 10 months? Looks good, but some lenders need a 12 months employment history. What happens if they have a credit card but it will be cleared before application? Some lenders will ignore it, some wont. What happens if the the customer receives child benefit? Most lenders will say they accept it, but if the child is 12-14+ lenders start to ignore it as it will stop soon. Having a default that fits criteria means you fit criteria, you could still fail credit score. Which lenders are more relaxed when scoring applicants? Which lenders are going to ask for an inside leg measurement? You dont want to be using them if the client wants to complete ASAP. 

I am not trying to make our job sound like brain surgery, but to answer your question your head needs to be full of criteria, it needs to know what will likely flag up as a problem you need to be prepared to think outside the box - customer may say they want something, but it is our job to advise whether that is the best way to do it or if there is an easier/cheaper/better way to do it. Rates are the easiest part of the job, any idiot can find the cheapest product, your there to make sure you go to a lender who will accept the client. 

We do not recommend developers, its down to the customer to find the property. You can recommend life insurance - do you know about PHI/Critical Illness/Life insurance? Which would you recommend to a single person, which to a family? Do you know about trusts, waiver of premium? Can you explain them to a customer? 

There is a lot to learn, it took me about 12 months before I felt like I was a mortgage broker. 

My income in year 1 was £7k and £12k in year 2. It did go up after that, but it took time, although I started out in 2011 and the recession was still quite fresh in peoples minds.