Court Proceddings for someone using my name in a pentalty fare

Jamie_98fernandes

I am a University student.

I was informed a letter from Greater Anglia Prosecution Unit on the 5th March 2020 when the date of the letter was 25th Feburary 2020.
My father told me that I had a ticket from GA in regards to a penalty fare. I have no knowledge of ever taking the train because owning a car
I use it to go to places and havent used the train for a while.

I believe that someone used my details and gave it to the ticket inspector. With the original fine being £29.40 they asked for and additional £80.00
for "towards our cost incured". It stated that I have 14days from the date to pay and not be liable for a conviction.

I contacted the 3rd party comany who handle this "IRCAS". I told them that I belive that someone took my details and used it in this instance.
They asked for the refernce number which I gave and my passport to be sent as an email.

I followed their request and sent the email attaching the supporting docuemnts they required, they then reply with the details matched the info
given on that day.

They then asked for proof of my whereabouts on the day of questions. I provided all the information that I had on me
which was my google maps location data. I asked them if they had my passport photo why don't you match my face to the bodyworn cameras
or CCTV.

They then reply to me saying that the information location data is irrelevent as it does not include the time the contrevention took place.
They told me that it happened at 06:36AM in the morning.
I then replied back to them saying that I can't provide evidence for that time because I would have been sleeping and there's no way of verifiying this.

I have now received a second letter from GA Prosecutions Unit, telling me that due to COVID19 the case will be ajourned to the 30th June 2020 and
you can settle this by paying a balance of £179.40. If not then the matter will go to court.


My question is:
How likely would it be that I am prosecuted if I go to court?

Many Thanks in advance

jonesMUFCforever

Two things - that you have already covered.
1 The photo on the passport must not match the Cam worn by the inspector unless you travelled in your sleep - ask to see the evidence before you get to court.
2 If you can prove that you were at home - anybody else in the house that can verify this? Does you car have a dash cam, or does your car have a black box??

Finally if someone has given your details it might be somebody that you know - any suspects?

Petriix

They can write whatever they like in a letter: they could ask that you provide them with a silver thimble of unicorn milk by midnight or they will charge you £1 million; but that doesn't make it legally enforceable. Either they have sufficient evidence to prove that you did travel without a ticket, in which case they can take you to court for their reasonable losses, or they don't and you will be able to easily refute their claim in front of a judge. As long as you respond appropriately to any genuine letter before action and file an appropriate defence should they proceed with the court case, the onus will be on them to provide sufficient proof that you did what they claim.

Jamie_98fernandes

jonesMUFCforever said:

Two things - that you have already covered.
1 The photo on the passport must not match the Cam worn by the inspector unless you travelled in your sleep - ask to see the evidence before you get to court.
2 If you can prove that you were at home - anybody else in the house that can verify this? Does you car have a dash cam, or does your car have a black box??

Finally if someone has given your details it might be somebody that you know - any suspects?

Yeah I have asked but they did not want to answer the question in the email.

Yeah My car does have a blackbox, I requested the data from my insurer, which shows that I started my day at 2pm. While the contrevention happend at 6AM it does not really help.

Yeah there are people I have fallen out with, that have the information.

Jamie_98fernandes

Petriix said:

They can write whatever they like in a letter: they could ask that you provide them with a silver thimble of unicorn milk by midnight or they will charge you £1 million; but that doesn't make it legally enforceable. Either they have sufficient evidence to prove that you did travel without a ticket, in which case they can take you to court for their reasonable losses, or they don't and you will be able to easily refute their claim in front of a judge. As long as you respond appropriately to any genuine letter before action and file an appropriate defence should they proceed with the court case, the onus will be on them to provide sufficient proof that you did what they claim.

I see your point, but could they not just argue that my name was given, DOB and Address was all matching.

es5595

If it’s not you, request again they review your passport photo with the body cam footage an cctv and drop the prosecution immediately. 

Assuming it went to your former address (your parents) rather than your uni address, highlight that it was most likely someone using your details since they’ve given the inspectors a former address for you. 

Additionally, request if they are not willing to drop proceedings, they proceed to prosecution and you’ll get your day in court, not the constant harassment letters asking for ridiculous fines. 

Finally, make sure all further letters are opened, and come back if you need assistance. Court isn’t difficult, especially if it wasn’t you, the magistrate/judge will very quickly ascertain the footage doesn’t match your face and they have no case.  

Stigy

Jamie_98fernandes said:

I am a University student.

I was informed a letter from Greater Anglia Prosecution Unit on the 5th March 2020 when the date of the letter was 25th Feburary 2020.
My father told me that I had a ticket from GA in regards to a penalty fare. I have no knowledge of ever taking the train because owning a car
I use it to go to places and havent used the train for a while.

I believe that someone used my details and gave it to the ticket inspector. With the original fine being £29.40 they asked for and additional £80.00
for "towards our cost incured". It stated that I have 14days from the date to pay and not be liable for a conviction.

I contacted the 3rd party comany who handle this "IRCAS". I told them that I belive that someone took my details and used it in this instance.
They asked for the refernce number which I gave and my passport to be sent as an email.

I followed their request and sent the email attaching the supporting docuemnts they required, they then reply with the details matched the info
given on that day.

They then asked for proof of my whereabouts on the day of questions. I provided all the information that I had on me
which was my google maps location data. I asked them if they had my passport photo why don't you match my face to the bodyworn cameras
or CCTV.

They then reply to me saying that the information location data is irrelevent as it does not include the time the contrevention took place.
They told me that it happened at 06:36AM in the morning.
I then replied back to them saying that I can't provide evidence for that time because I would have been sleeping and there's no way of verifiying this.

I have now received a second letter from GA Prosecutions Unit, telling me that due to COVID19 the case will be ajourned to the 30th June 2020 and
you can settle this by paying a balance of £179.40. If not then the matter will go to court.


My question is:
How likely would it be that I am prosecuted if I go to court?

Many Thanks in advance

If this genuinely wasn't you, you need to tell them it wasn't you and supply whatever evidence you can. If they still chose to issue a summons, then you need to plead not guilty and attend court.  The worst thing you could do will be to hope this goes away and ignore them (which I'm sure you won't do), as you will then be found guilty in your absence regardless. It is the job of their Prosecutor to prove that it was you, not for you to prove that it wasn't. If they issue a summons, you'll more than likely find the case is withdrawn on the day. Bear in mind that if the staff member noted a concise description of his or her customer, that will form part of the TOC's evidence. Most descriptions are pretty bleak, but if they noted distinguishing marks/tattoos etc, this could easily put you in the clear, as much as it could prove the defendant WAS you (which, as you say, it wasn't).

You mentioned Body Worn Video? Was this mentioned at all? Chances are they won't be allowed to use it anyway as the usage is usually governed very strictly and their policy won't allow the use of this in evidence in such cases unless there was an assault of some description and/or a police investigation (whereby the police seized the footage). It would be able to be used legally, but the company probably won't use it as evidence in such a case. The same is usually said for CCTV, not least because by the time they realise they could utilise it, the footage has been wiped (this being a Penalty Fare matter initially, there would have been a period of at least a month awaiting appeals and preparing for the next stages of the process).

Hasbeen

The op mentioned "bodyworn cameras," that some train staff wear even though he has no knowledge of travelling on trains? I would think whoever impersonated the Op provided the ticket inspector with proof of ID, letter with address, Driving license. etc. If not then there is no proof!

Would not think that any "evidence" provided by cctv would be applicable but perhaps wrong?

The Op has provided proof that it was him, not travelling at that time/date. So he should be asking what proof they have that he is the one travelling?

Also Op as others have mentioned this impersonation is by someone who knows you.

Op perhaps better advice from railway "experts" would be available in this forum?

I would post there, but let us know eventual outcome. Good luck!

https://www.railforums.co.uk/forums/disputes-prosecutions.152/

Stigy

Hasbeen said:

The op mentioned "bodyworn cameras," that some train staff wear even though he has no knowledge of travelling on trains? I would think whoever impersonated the Op provided the ticket inspector with proof of ID, letter with address, Driving license. etc. If not then there is no proof!

Would not think that any "evidence" provided by cctv would be applicable but perhaps wrong?

The Op has provided proof that it was him, not travelling at that time/date. So he should be asking what proof they have that he is the one travelling?

Also Op as others have mentioned this impersonation is by someone who knows you.

Op perhaps better advice from railway "experts" would be available in this forum?

I would post there, but let us know eventual outcome. Good luck!

https://www.railforums.co.uk/forums/disputes-prosecutions.152/

He's already posted in that forum (I replied in both). I agree about the Bodycam part to an extent, however loads of TOCs use Body Worn Video now, so it's often an assumption to be honest. What I mentioned "over there" that I didn't here though, is; Even for someone to know you, requires the actual perpetrator to know the OP's name, (full) address and date of birth, and be able to relay this, in the heat of the moment, whilst off-guard. Most people wouldn't be able to give smaller details such as door number/post code and the OP's actual DoB, let alone get the details correct. This is all assuming that the RPI is professional/experienced enough to be able to pull someone up who is hesitant about 'their' details, rather than just assuming they're correct and indeed assuming the original penalty fare notice was completed in its entirety (sometimes DoB could be left off for example, as a passenger is not obliged to supply it in the same way they are their name and address).

DCFC79

Keep the thread updated.

ThunderHoof

Prosecution have to prove beyond reasonable doubt, don't see how they are going to do that without any evidence