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Possible Transfer Value and Advice

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  • p00hsticksp00hsticks Forumite
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    Thank you. I have a further meeting with the Advisor next week and am going to ask – if you recommend not to transfer, and I then decide to go ahead, will you advise my Final Salary Scheme that you have given me all the info (and I have decided to go against this). I will also phone the Scheme helpline and ask them if this is sufficient.

    As far as I'm aware, it's not the Final salary scheme you need to inform/persuade - it's whatever scheme you intend to move into.

    You need to be asking the advisor firstly to confirm that s/he is a Pension Transfer Specialist, and then, assuming s/he says yes - if you recommend not to transfer, will you still sign the necessary paperwork to confirm that you have given advice that I can then use to transfer out.
  • p00hsticks wrote: »
    As far as I'm aware, it's not the Final salary scheme you need to inform/persuade - it's whatever scheme you intend to move into.

    You need to be asking the advisor firstly to confirm that s/he is a Pension Transfer Specialist, and then, assuming s/he says yes - if you recommend not to transfer, will you still sign the necessary paperwork to confirm that you have given advice that I can then use to transfer out.

    Ah I see. So much (great) info - I am going to take all day Sunday to go over my options and decide my course of action.
  • AlanP_2AlanP_2 Forumite
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    p00hsticks wrote: »
    As far as I'm aware, it's not the Final salary scheme you need to inform/persuade - it's whatever scheme you intend to move into.

    You need to be asking the advisor firstly to confirm that s/he is a Pension Transfer Specialist, and then, assuming s/he says yes - if you recommend not to transfer, will you still sign the necessary paperwork to confirm that you have given advice that I can then use to transfer out.

    The legal position is that you have to satisfy the trustees of the FS/DB scheme that you have received advice, from a qualified person, as you are giving up a safeguarded benefit.

    Whether that advice is Go or Stay is of no concern to them.

    The requirement that some receiving providers have in place that they only accept positive transfers is not a legal requirement but is their operational decision.
  • ZingPowZingZingPowZing Forumite
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    You are right to be wary, PlanToRetire. Your instinct is correct imo.

    When you commit to pay an adviser regardless of whether he provides a positive recommendation, you will get a negative recommendation, because that is the safer course for the adviser. So, not only would you be throwing away £5k, you wouldn't even know if the advice is correct for you.

    And then, unless you adviser has given a prior undertaking to sign a declaration on the receiving scheme of whatever provider you can find before the CETV deadline, your only recourse would be to move it to AJ Bell or start the process again with a new CETV.

    Such was my experience but I'm not saying don't do it. I did turn my DB into a SIPP and would have regretted it sorely if I hadn't - following my first adviser's recommendation would have been a far bigger mistake than paying him off.
    what will you do now,
    with the gift of your left life?
  • AlanP_2AlanP_2 Forumite
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    p00hsticks wrote: »
    As far as I'm aware, it's not the Final salary scheme you need to inform/persuade - it's whatever scheme you intend to move into.

    You need to be asking the advisor firstly to confirm that s/he is a Pension Transfer Specialist, and then, assuming s/he says yes - if you recommend not to transfer, will you still sign the necessary paperwork to confirm that you have given advice that I can then use to transfer out.

    The legal position is that you have to satisfy the trustees of the FS/DB scheme that you have received advice, from a qualified person, as you are giving up a safeguarded benefit.

    Whether that advice is Go or Stay is of no concern to them.

    The requirement that some receiving providers have in place that they only accept positive transfers is not a legal requirement but is their operational decision.

    Theoretically you could ask a SIPP provider to transfer your benefits from the XYZ Ltd DB Scheme and the point at which "has advice been taken" question will be answered is when XYZ Ltd Db Scheme Admin receive the transfer request as they are the ones on the hook not the SIPP provider.
  • ZingPowZingZingPowZing Forumite
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    Thank you. I have a further meeting with the Advisor next week and am going to ask – if you recommend not to transfer, and I then decide to go ahead, will you advise my Final Salary Scheme that you have given me all the info (and I have decided to go against this). I will also phone the Scheme helpline and ask them if this is sufficient.

    Also get an undertaking that the adviser will sign a declaration on the transfer-in form of the pension; no reason why he should refuse, you may think, but mine did and it effectively prevented me from moving directly to the provider of my choice.
    what will you do now,
    with the gift of your left life?
  • cfw1994cfw1994 Forumite
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    I suspect all it will take is a significant market crash, nothing out of the ordinary, just similar to those seen in the past and we will move into "PPI" territory.

    At which point people like the op (no offence intended) will start to plead they were misled. Hopefully there will be sufficient audit trail nowadays to show they were going against the professional advice to stay put.

    I cannot understand how that (bold) would possibly be the case. Well, I can imagine them grumbling......
    ....but if a company advised to NOT transfer out, and they did - there is a clear line to the advice that keeps the company entirely in the clear. Nothing like PPI whatsoever, surely - any evidence to suggest otherwise?
    MallyGirl wrote: »
    The problem is the cost of the insurance I believe. I am pretty sure there have been cases of negative recommendation, insistent client transfer, it all goes pear-shaped and the client still successfully claimed against the advisor who told not to transfer.

    Any evidence? I cannot see how any reasonable legal system would find in favour of such a plaintiff, given that scenario!



    OP, when having that initial conversation with an IFA, I *suspect* you may be wise to allow them to believe they would manage your pot forever after. Do check on costs/fees to move out later if you wanted to, but if the IFA expects to them be managing your wealth, I would imagine they would be more inclined to want you as a customer ;)

    Of course I could be wrong.....but......

    Good luck!
    Plan for tomorrow, enjoy today!
  • ZingPowZingZingPowZing Forumite
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    Alanp wrote: »
    The legal position is that you have to satisfy the trustees of the FS/DB scheme that you have received advice, from a qualified person, as you are giving up a safeguarded benefit.

    Whether that advice is Go or Stay is of no concern to them.

    The requirement that some receiving providers have in place that they only accept positive transfers is not a legal requirement but is their operational decision.

    Theoretically you could ask a SIPP provider to transfer your benefits from the XYZ Ltd DB Scheme and the point at which "has advice been taken" question will be answered is when XYZ Ltd Db Scheme Admin receive the transfer request as they are the ones on the hook not the SIPP provider.

    Bad timing, I posted almost at the same time as AlanP. Most SIPP providers' transfer-in forms
    require the signature of a financial adviser (simply to the fact that advice has been provided) and will not accept a transfer without it. Again, it's self-protection.
    what will you do now,
    with the gift of your left life?
  • Bad timing, I posted almost at the same time as AlanP. Most SIPP providers' transfer-in forms
    require the signature of a financial adviser (simply to the fact that advice has been provided) and will not accept a transfer without it. Again, it's self-protection.

    So it really sounds like I need to have the destination SIPP set up first, and to also ensure that the IFA is willing to sign the declaration on the transfer-in form.

    That’s before they actually give advice and I make my decision!
  • cfw1994 wrote: »
    OP, when having that initial conversation with an IFA, I *suspect* you may be wise to allow them to believe they would manage your pot forever after. Do check on costs/fees to move out later if you wanted to, but if the IFA expects to them be managing your wealth, I would imagine they would be more inclined to want you as a customer ;)

    Of course I could be wrong.....but......

    Good luck!

    Thanks, I sussed that out pretty quick from my meeting yesterday, so was going to give that impression regardless. Always helps to grease the wheels!
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