Embrace Financial Services - advice fee

SonOf

Deleted_User wrote: »

My fee agreements have always only been generated and signed at the same time as the application is submitted.
I assumed everyone else did the same but maybe i'm wrong

Our mortgage advisers do the same. There are some out there that commit the person earlier.

kingstreet

If a fee was going to be payable to us; every illustration going out would show it and when it is paid.

Our first illustration* is issued within two working hours of the receipt of the enquiry, unless we need more information to complete affordability.

* This is example two and five year fixed rates based on 27Tech's best value over the initial period.

amnblog

I have no idea why any broker would do any work on a case without first getting the borrowers agreement to any fees that may be down the line.

ACG

Deleted_User wrote: »

My fee agreements have always only been generated and signed at the same time as the application is submitted.
I assumed everyone else did the same but maybe i'm wrong

But you must have told the customer about the fees before that? As AMN says, from a practical point of view, why would you be doing work if the customer had not agreed to it? That is before you get to a compliance perspective where you have to tell the customer at the earliest opportunity.

The way we work is to have a chat with the customer about their situation on the first call/email exchange. If they are happy with that, we set them up on our system which then sends out an automated email with a copy of our terms of business, fee agreement and factfind, along with a generic list of documents we will need. The customer can then click a link to electronically sign and agree to the fee agreement and terms. All of that is done before we complete a factfind.

Customers are free to back out without incurring any costs right up until we name the lender/obtain a DIP.

[Deleted User]

ACG wrote: »

But you must have told the customer about the fees before that? As AMN says, from a practical point of view, why would you be doing work if the customer had not agreed to it? That is before you get to a compliance perspective where you have to tell the customer at the earliest opportunity.

The way we work is to have a chat with the customer about their situation on the first call/email exchange. If they are happy with that, we set them up on our system which then sends out an automated email with a copy of our terms of business, fee agreement and factfind, along with a generic list of documents we will need. The customer can then click a link to electronically sign and agree to the fee agreement and terms. All of that is done before we complete a factfind.

Customers are free to back out without incurring any costs right up until we name the lender/obtain a DIP.

Oh yeah of course. Within first 15-20 minutes after a mini fact find I need to know we are on the same wavelength that they are prepared to pay me a fee of some sort. Similar to you, my fee varies depending on the case but i have examples I will tell them for 'normal' and then the extremes like self build or heavy adverse. Equally if they are doing multiple mortgages I will inevitably charge a reduced total as a lot of the work on the system at least is duplicated.
There has got to be an understanding right at the start that a payment of some sort will be made.

I don't charge until app is submitted so DIP's aren't chargeable and I'll generally tell them which lender I intend to go to upfront (unless they have loads of options in which case I'll assess service standards / rates / fees etc on the day of application). To be honest I very rarely go to DIP unless the case is a bit wobbly. Probably a difference in business models as a lot of my stuff is prime so i dont have any worries about it passing credit checks
My cases will be a bit higher probably as I work further in the south so i can see why you would charge at DIP stage as you cant make the lost time up from the proc on other cases like i can.

ACG

I dont charge at DIP stage, I actually charge on full offer of a Mortgage. But in our fee agreement it says if you decide to pull out after we get a DIP/name the lender we reserve the right to charge an admin fee.

The reason for that is quite simply, people used to pump us for information and then go off to do it direct. Without wanting to sound mercenary, that obviously does not pay the bills. So whilst our fee is only chargeable on offer, the customer will be liable for an admin fee if they pull out once we have done the research and told them where we plan to go.

red_imps_2003

Thanks everybody. To be absolutely clear, I have no issue whatsoever with Embrace or the adviser. Any failure to fully pick up on the fee for the service would have been entirely my own fault. Like I say, I used the same broker just last year. All I am wondering is at what point do I become fully liable to pay that fee? We have agreed on a product that suits us and he has forwarded an illustration to review but we have not yet submitted the application to the lender.

[Deleted User]

red_imps_2003 wrote: »

Thanks everybody. To be absolutely clear, I have no issue whatsoever with Embrace or the adviser. Any failure to fully pick up on the fee for the service would have been entirely my own fault. Like I say, I used the same broker just last year. All I am wondering is at what point do I become fully liable to pay that fee? We have agreed on a product that suits us and he has forwarded an illustration to review but we have not yet submitted the application to the lender.

Depends on the wording on the Initial Disclosure Document you should have been given at the start. If you werent given this document I would argue you can back out at any point with no fee being payable as you didnt have the information given to make a decision.

Majority charge on application, offer, or completion.

You'll have to find the document you were given to see what it says under the fees and charges section

ACG

red_imps_2003 wrote: »

Any failure to fully pick up on the fee for the service would have been entirely my own fault.

I am not sure I agree with that.
The broker should have told you what the fee would be. We have returning customers and I always go back over our fees, typically they are lower as a returning customer than a new customer but I still need to make sure the customer knows about them.