There is nothing special about the nhs

Kentish_Dave

If it’s such a great system, why have so few people copied it?

melanzana

Kentish_Dave wrote: »

If it’s such a great system, why have so few people copied it?

Indeed.

The NHS has made us all expect everything for nothing. Well I know it is funded, but still the perception is out there that it is free for all. It isn't.

BikingBud

tacpot12 wrote: »

I read an early retirement blog called Early Retirement Now. It is written by an American and has mostly American comments. A recent retiree (60 years old and healthy) commented that he has to paying $800 per month (£500 per month) for health insurance. I've never paid that much per month in NI contributions, and neither will 99% of the UK population. I think the NHS offers great value for money.

I am sure you realise that it's not just the NI contributions that pay for the NHS.

tacpot12 wrote: »

It is very efficient for a large organisation.

Really? There is significant and continual waste within the organisation and structure of the NHS but its no different from other nations: http://www.oecd.org/health/tackling-wasteful-spending-on-health-9789264266414-en.htm

Following a brief pause after the economic crisis, health expenditure is rising again in most OECD countries. Yet, a considerable part of this health expenditure makes little or no contribution to improving people's health. In some cases, it even results in worse health outcomes. Countries could potentially spend significantly less on health care with no impact on health system performance, or on health outcomes. This report systematically reviews strategies put in place by countries to limit ineffective spending and waste.

tacpot12 wrote: »

Politically motivated meddling in the service has to stop, for all our sakes.

Yes but if we took out health service and education and defence and the justice system, including policing; all of which suffer from political meddling then, why would we need 650 wasters in the HOC?:(

BikingBud

melanzana wrote: »

Indeed.

The NHS has made us all expect everything for nothing. Well I know it is funded, but still the perception is out there that it is free for all. It isn't.

It's free at the time of use. We pay a lifetime of a variety of taxes to fund the system so that if and when we need it, it is there.

And although that is a great comfort, the problems arise when the demographic shift means more people are taking out than paying in. So if we do not want to pay more either proper efficiencies have to be made or the level of service must reduce.

kinger101

Kentish_Dave wrote: »

If it’s such a great system, why have so few people copied it?

There are plenty of countries which offer healthcare systems funded by the government and paid for by taxes. No two will be the same.

Herzlos

BikingBud wrote: »

It's free at the time of use. We pay a lifetime of a variety of taxes to fund the system so that if and when we need it, it is there.

And although that is a great comfort, the problems arise when the demographic shift means more people are taking out than paying in. So if we do not want to pay more either proper efficiencies have to be made or the level of service must reduce.

We're pretty bad at the whole penny wise pound foolish thing here. There are a lot of cheap treatments delayed until expensive due to cost cutting.

seven-day-weekend

SweetPotatoPie wrote: »

Better outcomes at a lower cost? Speak to any American who can’t afford healthcare. Speak to families who are in debt for the rest of their lives due to losing a family member. I think we are very lucky to have the NHS.

There are other models than the American one.

I think that the NHS is expected to do a lot of things it was never intended to. Certain things such as IVF, Gender Reassignment, Elective Cosmetic Surgery and other lifestyle choices should not be available on the NHS. There should be a hefty fine for missing appointments without a cast-iron reason.

I think it should still be free at the point of use.

lisyloo

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

There are other models than the American one.

I think that the NHS is expected to do a lot of things it was never intended to. Certain things such as IVF, Gender Reassignment, Elective Cosmetic Surgery and other lifestyle choices should not be available on the NHS. There should be a hefty fine for missing appointments without a cast-iron reason.

I think it should still be free at the point of use.

Agree with most of your points except the cosmetic surgery part.
I’m not sure I’d want to deny an acid victim, fireman or war hero the chance to have cosmetic surgery. Maybe the cosmetic surgery needs further granularity.

The test is really how would you want your daughter or son treated.

I’d like to see it maintained but I’d be willing to pay more tax (as always wanting that to be efficiently spent).

I think there is something special about health.

seven-day-weekend

lisyloo wrote: »

Agree with most of your points except the cosmetic surgery part.
I’m not sure I’d want to deny an acid victim, fireman or war hero the chance to have cosmetic surgery. Maybe the cosmetic surgery needs further granularity.

The test is really how would you want your daughter or son treated.

I’d like to see it maintained but I’d be willing to pay more tax (as always wanting that to be efficiently spent).

I said ELECTIVE cosmetic surgery - i.e the patient has elected to have it just because they can (boob enhancements, nose jobs etc).. I would not include the people you have mentioned in that; they of course should continue to have it on the NHS.

spadoosh

tacpot12 wrote: »

I've never paid that much per month in NI contributions, and neither will 99% of the UK population. I think the NHS offers great value for money.

It does doesnt it.

National insurance generates some £143 billion a year. And manages to pay for £125 billion in health spending. ~£95 billion in state pensions. O and the few hundred billion in unemployment benefits. (some of the costs will overlap).