Suspended Bay

alpha_charlie

I left my car parked in a council permit resident bay before work on 29/04/19 and went to collect it the following day after work 30/04/19.

I found the car with two parking tickets dated:

29/04/2019 18:21
30/04/2019 17:03

When parking the car I could not see any signage and when collecting my car I could not see any signage that would relate to the Contravention 21 'parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space'.

At the time I took photos of the orange barriers the had been put up behind the car and then had left actioning this for some time (yes I've passed the 14 days).

When I have looked online I can see there are several photos of the car, the bay with barriers and then a sign - to which I could not see on the railings in any of my photos.

By the second day they didn't even provide photo evidence of the car registration.

What do you advise I do, such signage seems incredibly ambiguous as to a start and end time, let alone trying to tie this to the times of the ticket, when does the '24 hours' begin and end, if it were 00:00 29/04/2019-23:59 29/04/2019 then why was I ticketed again on the 30/04/19 at 17:03.

Can you please advise, should I contest either/both/none of these?

Photos on Penalty Charge Notice for 29/04/19

1/7:



2/7:


3/7:


4/7:


5/7:


6/7:


7/7:

Photos on Penalty Charge Notice for 30/04/19

1/2:



2/2:

Thanks,

Alpha

Redx

I suggest you post all this over on pepipoo fightback forums in their council section (do not use a hotmail address for signup)

we tend to deal with private parking companies on here

Coupon-mad

https://ibb.co/sJbL4G1

https://ibb.co/Y7wYbFS

Ealing PCN then - can't see that sign is anywhere near your car, and even if a motorist saw the sign, how are people supposed to work out how long '14 spaces' is unless they are individually marked? Needed more clarity of signs, seems to me.

I see you have posted on pepipoo so keep replying and you'll get help throughout:

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=127858

alpha_charlie

@COUPON-MAD

I am of the mindset to object the second ticket on the objection gounds of 'The contravention did not occur' with the following text:

Please confirm:

- when the suspension signs were first put on public display

- the location of ALL signs available to motorists who parked on chase road.

- where the photo evidence was taken in relation to the vehicle.

- the start date and time the bay was suspended FROM.

- the start date and time the bay was suspended TO.

- how it is possible for the general public to identify 55 Chase Road.

- how it is possible for the general public to identify 'Alexanders Warehouse'

Additionally:

- provide a digital copy of the A4 document affixed to the yellow board, of which does not have all text legible in photo evidence provided.

What do you think? Will it aid the first ticket?

Additionally I am thinking to question:

- is the sign even valid? it looks like a triangle that's been stuck against a wall, not a lamp post to which a motorist could even see it
- to provide evidence from the bay vehicle log which would show the vehicle had been parked there before any such signage was put up

Thanks for any help you can provide!

KeithP

You have already had an excellent response to those questions on Pepipoo.

Coupon-mad

Great response there from cp8759, all pepipoo's own work:

Dear Sir or Madam,

I parked my car in a residents' bay before work on 29 April and went to collect it the following day after work, 30th April. I found the car with two parking tickets dated: 29/04/2019 18:21 and 30/04/2019 17:03. When parking the car I did not see any signage and when collecting my car I could not see any signage that would relate to the Contravention 21 'parked wholly or partly in a suspended bay or space'.

I note the timing of the photos taken by the CEO suggest the sign was in close proximity to my vehicle, so it is inherently unlikely I would have missed it had it been there at the time I parked. If a log of cars parked in the bay was taken at the time the sign was put up, you should find my vehicle registration on said log. In any event as the sign was not in place at the time when I parked, the alleged contravention did not occur as I had no notice of the suspension.

Furthermore, the signage is defective. The sign is not authorised by the Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016, but by special authorisation GT50/077/0014, published by the Department for Transport at http://assets.dft.gov.uk/trafficauths/case-3834.pdf

Article 1(a) of the authorisation provides that "information regarding the time of day, date or dates (with or without the year) and location of the suspended parking place or places shall be shown on the authorised sign", the suspension was meant to run from 29 to 30th April and for a period of 24 hours, this cannot be correct: A suspension starting from the beginning of the 29th to the end of the 30th would be a 48 hour suspension. If the suspension was meant to run from a certain time on the 29th to a certain time on the 30th, the sign should have specified this for example by stating "from 1pm on 29th to 1pm on 30th", but no wording to this effect is present on the sign.

As a result, it is impossible from the sign to determine when the 24 hour suspension was meant to begin or end, it follows that the sign does not adequately convey the hours of the suspension and for that reason the alleged contravention did not occur.

In any event the second PCN is invalid as the council has no powers to issue a 2nd PCN for a single contravention.

Obviously you have to do this twice, once for each PCN as they are both improperly issued (the contravention did not occur, in both cases).