missing NI credits when on low income

alexix

Hi, being born in 1954 I am having to wait an extra 5 years to collect my pension ( forget all this no longer than 3 years nonsense) I am due to start claiming November 2020. As if it is not bad enough to lose 5 years of pension and having to keep paying NI contributions for those extra 5 years, I find I have many years missed contributions so losing out even more. I was self employed for many years on low earnings, and was did not need to pay class 4 NI, I was told I would be credited, seems not so.

My husband is so annoyed because he paid stamps all those years in the belief my pension would be Ok, and would have happily paid my class 2 voluntary if it was necessary. In all I think the HMRC new rules has cost me £30,000 of lost pension over past 5 years, plus around another £3,900 in extra NI payments. And because I cannot claim on my husbands contributions I am losing about £30 week due to reduced pension for the rest of my life. To say we are a bit annoyed about this is an understatement.

At the time my husband believed I would claim pension on his stamps which were all fully paid, not so now it seems. And proving what I paid in NI stamps 30 odd years ago and more is clearly not possible.

So am I right in thinking because I worked for low income rather than claim The Dole money I lose my right to state pension credits for those missing years?

Mojisola

Have you done a pension check?

https://www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

JezR

If self-employed it is not Class 4 contributions that are important for a state pension it is Class 2. Did you elect not to pay these?

There is no specific credit for low earnings; you needed to be in receipt of certain benefits, or maybe what was called Home Responsibilities Protection.

Did you early on in your working life ever pay reduced rate National Insurance for married women?

drumtochty

[FONT=&quot]If you claim the "dole" and you do not take any jobs offered your "dole" money would have been stopped, therefore it was not a case of free NI because you did not want to work.[/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]Sorry but for the past 25 years I have checked my own and my good ladies state pension entitlement rather than waiting until it is too late and have paid voluntary contributions for her when she would have lost out.[/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]You and your husband like most other people should have kept an eye on your pension entitlement rather than "deciding" that you husband’s "stamps" would cover your pension. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Sorry you are not an oppressed minority; you are both responsible adults who did not cover their backsides by checking your pension status every few years for say the past 20 years. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Your future income, your job to check it or do you disagree.[/FONT]
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[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]The increase in ladies state pension ages were well publisised in the press end of story and why should ladies state pension age not be matched with males state pension age.
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redux

If someone was self-employed then unemployed, or then only employed by for instance an agency a day or two a week, then even they couldn't claim unemployment benefit they could still sign on and have NI contributions deemed. I'm sure I did this briefly some time in the 1980s.

Or if they were self-employed and on low earnings, whilst they could claim exemption from Class 2 contributions, it has been clear enough that eventually not having enough contribution years could affect state pension, so for sustained years of low earnings it might be sensible to pay voluntarily.

As already hinted above, changes in pension age for women have been known in advance for years.

Can you go back for up to 6 years and make up some Class 2 contributions? I don't know if this is still true, but it did use to be. Better advice than mine needed on whether these would still be counted.

Marcon

alexix wrote: »

Hi, being born in 1954 I am having to wait an extra 5 years to collect my pension ( forget all this no longer than 3 years nonsense) I am due to start claiming November 2020.

If you were born in 1954 and are due to start claiming in November 2020, I think you'll find your SPA is 66 - so an extra 6 years.

alexix

Thanks, yes did pension check that's how I know what I will receive and why.

Madly I was not made aware that I needed to pay extra NI stamps to claim a pension, and although I was on low income self-employment I claimed no benefits as my husband earned just enough to get by. And no I did not claim any reduced rate National Insurance for married women? it was never discussed, I was not aware of it.

I did not claim unemployment benefit as I wanted to earn my keep and work self employed. We did not know the whole system would be changed and suddenly my husband's contributions did not count any more.

I am one of the many who were not made aware of the changes and what I could do to help, I could not belive I would be fiddled out of 5 years pension and even so I don't thnk I could not have paid enough into any private pension in the time given, we always earned just enough to get by without bothering with benefits and such. Perhaps I would have been better off scrounging. I am sure this would never have been tried with if this was a Company Private Pension Scheme.
So that's that then...

DairyQueen

Did you receive letters advising you of missing NI credits? As I recall, I received these annually for some years, beginning sometime in the 'noughties'. These letters gave details of missing years and part-years, and of the voluntary payments required to fund the years that didn't qualify.

I believe that you are correct that, under the old rules, you could claim credits based on your husband's NI record. I believe that you are therefore justified in feeling disgruntled by a rule change that wasn't as widely-publicised.

However, do you think it reasonable that, under the old rules, some married women received a 'free ride' into a state pension? Do you think it reasonable that couples (many on low incomes), who had each paid sufficient NI to qualify, should receive the same SP as your household? Do you think it reasonable that this benefit should be reserved for married women? Do you think it fair that all men, and single women, had to pay to qualify?

The legislation that ended SP gender inequality was passed in the mid 90s. It was a high profile, media issue. We 50s women were given many years notice that our pension age was increasing. Again, was it reasonable that women received the SP (then) 5 years earlier than men?

You have not been 'fiddled' out of six/five/three years pension. A small cohort of 1950s women (born in 1953 as I recall) were given little notice (in around 2011 I think) that their pension age was increasing by, I believe, up to an additional 18 months. That cohort IMO are the only 50s women who have some justification for complaint.

I'm unclear why you think that you should be entitled to NI credits because you forewent unemployment benefit. That benefit isn't a lifestyle choice, it's intended for those who are, err, unemployed, not for those who choose self-employment. Btw, it couldn't be claimed long-term.

You have these expectations that you should receive payments from a system to which you have not contributed. The changes to the SP were designed to prevent exactly that.

The new SP has created winners and losers, Ironically, the lower paid are deemed to be the most advantaged by the abolition of the (earnings-related) second state pension in favour of a single tier for all. However, the new system is based on the premise that only those (of either gender) who have made sufficient contribution, through payments or home responsibilities, are entitled to benefit, and that benefit is pro-rated to years of contributions. Again, is that unfair?

I am not as unsympathetic to your plight as I appear. Many women of the generations that preceded you (including my mother and all of my aunts) worked all of their lives at low-paid, non-pensionable jobs, and opted to pay the reduced 'married women's NI' as a way to save a little, much-needed money. They never questioned their financial dependence on their husbands. That was how the system operated.

We 50s women are the first generation to transition away from that patriarchal system. We are considered equal in rights and in responsibilities under SP rules. We were warned repeatedly of the forthcoming changes. It is surprising that you have remained ignorant of this for the best part of 25 years.

Mojisola

alexix wrote: »

Hi, being born in 1954 I am having to wait an extra 5 years to collect my pension I am due to start claiming November 2020. As if it is not bad enough to lose 5 years of pension and having to keep paying NI contributions for those extra 5 years, I find I have many years missed contributions so losing out even more.

Isn't it good that you can keep gaining NI years towards your pension and so increase what you will receive?

suki1964

Im in the same boat, low income and many years of NI contributions not completed

Im 55 and what Im going doing is paying the 5 years that are the cheapest - about £200 a year

if you look at your statement you can find the years which are cheapest and when the final payment date can be made. Its not going to be easy for me to find the money but needs must and find it I will

mgdavid

alexix wrote: »

Thanks, yes did pension check that's how I know what I will receive and why.

Madly I was not made aware that I needed to pay extra NI stamps to claim a pension, and although I was on low income self-employment I claimed no benefits as my husband earned just enough to get by. And no I did not claim any reduced rate National Insurance for married women? it was never discussed, I was not aware of it.

I did not claim unemployment benefit as I wanted to earn my keep and work self employed. We did not know the whole system would be changed and suddenly my husband's contributions did not count any more.

I am one of the many who were not made aware of the changes and what I could do to help, I could not belive I would be fiddled out of 5 years pension and even so I don't thnk I could not have paid enough into any private pension in the time given, we always earned just enough to get by without bothering with benefits and such. Perhaps I would have been better off scrounging. I am sure this would never have been tried with if this was a Company Private Pension Scheme.
So that's that then...

You need to realise it is your responsibility to make yourself aware of the rules around NI and state pensions.Surely it is in the individual's best interests to do so rather than sit back, do nothing and wait to be spoonfed? Both broadsheets and tabloids have personal finance sections, they make useful reading. It's never too late to start.

The increase in women's SP age from 60 to 65 was announced 19 (yes nineteen!) years before it came into being, it was widely broadcast at the time on TV, in newspapers and magazines and also in the majority of cases by letter from DWP.