Can you imagine the destruction in the UK if the property market crashed

lisyloo

phillw wrote: »

I've been in mine 13 & I'm saving up to gut the place. New kitchen, bathroom, carpets, decorating, boiler, board out loft, replace some double glazing.

Most of that is probably discretionary though.

Do you think you’d get a refurbishment and new carpets in a rented place? No you wouldn’t (unless you’re paying for it I’m the rental). In general you’ll get the minimum quality that’s economically viable for the type of property because it’s an investment not a home.

Not a level playing field.

People with homes generally don’t HAVE to decorate is they chose not to.

lisyloo

James_Green_1982 wrote: »

Why would you be paying for my care? That makes no sense.

How many care homes have you visited (us — about 21).
How many within the local authority budget were acceptable (us - 0).

I’d strongly suggest you rethink your strategy unless you want to be in overmydeadbody grove or split up from your partner.

The LA wanted to split up my FIL and MIL after 60 years of marriage despite there being a place available in the same home.

Fortunately they had strong advocacy and we won but that is partly down to bed blocking/fines being on our side so we had some luck also.

Make sure you have strong advocacy. Do you have an LPA or EPA?

James_Green_1982

phillw wrote: »

I expect free NHS care and whatever remains of social care to disappear within the next two decades now that we're leaving the EU, if you can't fund it yourself then you'll be left to die somewhere. By that point you'll be too weak to vote.

Of course the NHS could be sold off etc. But I think it's unlikely, as there is not the political will for it among the public. I think the Tories would have got rid of free health care years ago - if they thought they could get away with it.
Another option is moving towards the US 'Medicaid' system, which is means based. Similar to our social care system at present. I think it's unlikely - but has happened in part (eg prescription charges) already.

I think it's unlikely people will be left without healthcare. The NHS continued to function even in South Armagh during the 1970s.

James_Green_1982

lisyloo wrote: »

If that really is you strategy then I would suggest making sure you live somewhere that there are decent quality care homes within the LA rate.

In our area BANES/south Glos they fall into the “over my dead body” category.

The proceeds of a house sale won't fund a nice care home place for long anyway. Once the funds run out you'd be reliant on the council funding.

Care fees are only going to increase in the future (increased wages, increased admin, compliance, reduced immigration etc.)

James_Green_1982

Exodi wrote: »

I thought it was kind of obvious... if you're not willing to pay for your own care.... someone else will have to pay for it...

That still makes no sense. Your taxes will be paying for the care of some people right now, as will mine.

I could be paying for your relative's care right now from my taxes - even if you were a millionaire. Because the government doesn't hold families responsible for their relatives.
Now that MAY change in the future. But no one knows.

lisyloo

James_Green_1982 wrote: »

The proceeds of a house sale won't fund a nice care home place for long anyway. Once the funds run out you'd be reliant on the council funding.

Care fees are only going to increase in the future (increased wages, increased admin, compliance, reduced immigration etc.)

Well actually it will fund for a while and people don’t tend to stay in care homes for long anyway (26 months on average) because if they are beyond 4 care visits a day they are usually in a pretty frail way to necessitate residential care.

You might also be interested to know that you can purchase an annuity (as you can with pensions) where it pays the fees for as long as you need them so that’s a potential solution. I am a deputy for someone whose lost capacity and I’ve just sold their home and researched annuities so I happen to know about these things.

It’s possible for a small minority that you could run out but it’s unlikely for the vast majority.

Don’t forget that those people will also get income and possibly some means tested benefits too so you might be able to knock of £300 per week for state pension and AA (plus any private pension income).

Just going into overmydeadbody grove from the start doesn’t seem to be a very good solution to the problem to me.

lisyloo

James_Green_1982 wrote: »

That still makes no sense. Your taxes will be paying for the care of some people right now, as will mine.

I could be paying for your relative's care right now from my taxes - even if you were a millionaire. Because the government doesn't hold families responsible for their relatives.
Now that MAY change in the future. But no one knows.

Out of interest how are you going to calculate spending your money I.e. estimate when (If) you’ll be going into residential care?

Lots of people doing drawdown would be fascinated if you have an answer.
The problem with drawdown is knowing when you’ll die so similar.

Have you communicated this strategy to someone else in case you lose capacity (you didn’t confirm if you had an LPA so I’m guessing not).

Is this a serious strategy (doesn’t sound like it to me) or just something for fun debate?

If it’s serious I would suggest visiting some care homes before you commit.

Exodi

James_Green_1982 wrote: »

That still makes no sense. Your taxes will be paying for the care of some people right now, as will mine.

I could be paying for your relative's care right now from my taxes - even if you were a millionaire. Because the government doesn't hold families responsible for their relatives.
Now that MAY change in the future. But no one knows.

I'm having trouble fathoming the difficulty you're having grasping this (especially having explained it yourself)? If you're not paying for your care, your care will have to be paid through tax; which as you've brilliantly explained above, is paid by the public. I'm not really sure what else to say, you're confusion has confused me?

James_Green_1982 wrote: »

The proceeds of a house sale won't fund a nice care home place for long anyway.

Right, ok. I think even you know you're spouting nonsense.

James_Green_1982

lisyloo wrote: »

Out of interest how are you going to calculate spending your money I.e. estimate when (If) you’ll be going into residential care?

Lots of people doing drawdown would be fascinated if you have an answer.
The problem with drawdown is knowing when you’ll die so similar.

Have you communicated this strategy to someone else in case you lose capacity (you didn’t confirm if you had an LPA so I’m guessing not).

Is this a serious strategy (doesn’t sound like it to me) or just something for fun debate?

If it’s serious I would suggest visiting some care homes before you commit.

Lots of elderly people are tenants rather than home owners. Not everyone needs to go into a care home. Look at all the elderly folk in supported care places etc.

No, I haven't made any specific plans because I have no idea what the situation will be like by that time. Anything could change in this country.

But in general terms, I would prefer to be renting (with a secure tenancy) in old age - rather than struggling to maintain a house I own, but with no money to spend. What would be the point in that?

Maybe I will sell my home to a relative and retain a life tenancy? Who knows? The rules and government will constantly change.

lisyloo

It’s also illegal to deliberately deprive yourself of assets for the purpose of gaining benefits from the state - it’s called deliberate deprivation.

Some methods are more obvious than others e.g. transfering a property to your offspring at the point of frailty is a dead giveaway.

There are less obvious ways that money can be moved/spent but the point remains that if done deliberately (as suggested) then it’s not legal and can be rolled back by the local authority e.g. a property can be taken from offspring (obviously if money was frittered away it can’t be take back)

So strategy so far - guess incarceration date, fritter away money, sit in own excrement with dressing hanging off?