Debt Query

nicsam

Thank you.

nicsam

Hi.
Further to my previous posts I have now received several credit card statements and then today a photocopy of my credit card agreement dated 2005. However, the letter attached from PRA still states that at present the debt is unenforceable. Any ideas why? Surely now they have provided this i should start paying them back again? I'm not complaining mind. Ha!!

kangoora

sourcrates wrote: »

Agree with the above.

Always worth going down the CCA route, incredibly, debts are sold on without a single piece of original agreement paperwork ever changing hands, they are stored by the original creditor, and they should keep them a maximum of 6 years, but things happen, agreements get lost, mis-filed, damaged, burnt, etc so they cannot always produce them when asked.
The consumer credit act is a lovely piece of legislation, its there for both the creditors, and your own, protection.


Sec 77/79 CCA 1978 covers the requesting of credit agreements, for credit card accounts, and loans, a creditor has 12 plus 2 days in which to comply, whilst he is complying, the agreement cannot be enforced through the courts, so no payment need be made.
If the creditor does produce a legible copy of the agreement that is compliant, then that is the end of the matter, but if they don`t, then the account cannot be enforced through the courts until they do, however long that may be.


In that scenario you could choose to just walk away and stop paying, or you could use the lack of a credit agreement as leverage to obtain a good discount to settle once and for all.
Remember, this is one of your statutory rights, so making such a request cannot be held against you.

Just an enquiry, I've had a barclaycard since about 1980 which has a substantial limit on it. If I defaulted on the payments on my current balance would they have to find the original 1980 contract/agreement for them to be able to enforce payment of the outstanding balance?

Taking it to extremes, what is there stopping anyone with CCs that they have held for, say, more than 20 years just defaulting? Apart from being, possibly, fraudulent - but then, if no original agreement still exists with the original card issuer is it still fraud?

sourcrates

nicsam wrote: »

Hi.
Further to my previous posts I have now received several credit card statements and then today a photocopy of my credit card agreement dated 2005. However, the letter attached from PRA still states that at present the debt is unenforceable. Any ideas why? Surely now they have provided this i should start paying them back again? I'm not complaining mind. Ha!!

Could be missing certain terms and conditions a credit agreement from that time should have had, if they say it’s unenforceable, I for one would not argue with them.

sourcrates

kangoora wrote: »

Just an enquiry, I've had a barclaycard since about 1980 which has a substantial limit on it. If I defaulted on the payments on my current balance would they have to find the original 1980 contract/agreement for them to be able to enforce payment of the outstanding balance?

Taking it to extremes, what is there stopping anyone with CCs that they have held for, say, more than 20 years just defaulting? Apart from being, possibly, fraudulent - but then, if no original agreement still exists with the original card issuer is it still fraud?

They can provide a reconstituted copy of the agreement, but it must contain all the elements of the original version, and must contain all the terms and conditions applicable at the time of signature.

Section 78 is a safeguard written into the consumer credit act, it is not supposed to be used as a means of debt avoidance, however it can be beneficial to the debtor if they are struggling financially and the creditor cannot comply.

Non compliance with a sec 78 request only takes away the ability of the creditor to use the courts to recover the debt, it still remains payable, and they can still chase you for it, and report to your credit file.

nicsam

Hi.

So following on from the above i have today received a letter from Pra stating that...

"Pra group Limited has purchased your outstanding balance with...
Your account is being managed by our investigations and Litigation Department to look at your outstanding debt for possible Litigation recovery.

We want to work with you to help you clear your remaining debt in an affordable manner, and we have fully trained account managers waiting to take your call. We will be honest and realistic in discussing all the opportunities with you to resolve this matter within a defined period of time.

If we do not hear from you, then we will be forced to undertake further investigations to gain an insight into your ability to pay the outstanding balance through information that is available to us. We look forward to hearing from you within 14 days of the date of this letter (26th April) to avoid us moving to the next stage."

As the last letter i received from them stated that my account is unenforceable would you say i've missed a letter saying otherwise or are they just trying to scare me (its working) into making payments?

Any advice appreciated.

Suseka97

Take a copy of the UE letter and return it with a covering letter to whichever department has sent you the most recent communication. Tell them that until they provide you with compliant paperwork in accordance with Sec 77/79 CCA 1978 - you will be making no further payments.

You have cancelled the DD, yes?

sourcrates

nicsam wrote: »

As the last letter i received from them stated that my account is unenforceable would you say i've missed a letter saying otherwise or are they just trying to scare me (its working) into making payments?

Any advice appreciated.

Just another in a standard series of debt collection letters these companies work through, thats all it is, they either take legal action, or they don`t, its a simple choice, worrying about it is pointless.


You have a letter from them stating the account is unenforcable, that is the ace in the pack, as good as it gets, nothing beats this hand, you have a "get out of jail free card".

Lets get some persepective here, they have addmited the debt is unenforcable, but, they can still make threats of litigation (even though they cant follow through with them) they can still ask you to pay, they can still report on your credit files, they can still write to you etc etc etc, what they cannot do, is obtain judgement against you in court, as they do not possess a legally enforcable credit agreement.

So it matters not a jot what they may say or threaten to do, as thats all they can do, without a compliant copy of the credit agreement, they have no remedy against you whatsoever, so all these letters mean only one thing....................absolutly nothing.

Do as suggested above, write and tell them you wont be paying as they admit to not having compliant paperwork, they will most likley drop the account like a hot stone.