Ir 35

unforeseen

Pennywise wrote: »

Not really. It's up to the client/engager to evaluate whether IR35 applies or not. In a lot of cases it won't apply. Also, the new rules don't apply if the client/engager is a small firm. It's up to the big "employers" to do a proper evaluation and change their contracts/working practices so that they're outside IR35. Otherwise they'll find fewer contractors willing to work for them or will have to increase their rates. This is what happened with the public sector - at first, they just lazily deemed all contractors to be caught but then soon had to change their methods once they couldn't keep their contractors and couldn't recruit new ones for the same money.

Some will adapt some won't. NHS Wales are one of those who haven't adapted, yet and the councils in my area are still working with the old rates and making just about every contract inside IR35.

I like your optimism but so far my experience doesn't agree with you.

Potbellypig

I always thought it was up to the contractor to prove their contract was outside IR35 and not for the company they are doing the work for to say whether it's inside or outside? My accountant has always said to me that it's my responsibility to say whether it's inside or outside. Luckily, I could easily prove my role to be outside IR35 and I'm a one-man-one contract Ltd company.

Pennywise

Potbellypig wrote: »

I always thought it was up to the contractor to prove their contract was outside IR35 and not for the company they are doing the work for to say whether it's inside or outside? My accountant has always said to me that it's my responsibility to say whether it's inside or outside. Luckily, I could easily prove my role to be outside IR35 and I'm a one-man-one contract Ltd company.

That's how it used to be. The rule changes turn it on it's head to make the engager responsible for making that decision.

Potbellypig

Pennywise wrote: »

That's how it used to be. The rule changes turn it on it's head to make the engager responsible for making that decision.

Thanks Pennywise. Is there a decent article anywhere explaining all of it?

chrismac1

One thing which is worth saying, not yet said, is that HMRC have either lost IR35 cases recently, or only avoided losing them by just coughing up to the other party at the Tribunal door.


Amusingly two of these cases involved sub-contractors where the parent hirer was HMRC itself! So you have a bizarre situation where one part of HMRC deems a contract outside IR35, and another part of HMRC opens up a tax enquiry to show that it is inside IR35!!!!!!!


So HMRC themselves are utterly clueless on whether the contracts they let are inside or outside IR35. If you are a limited company contractor, anyone who says "give up mate you are trapped inside IR35" is talking out of a body part where the sun does not shine.

unforeseen

Yes but under the new regulations it will be up to you as the contractor to take it to court to prove that you are outside IR35. HMRC will not be involved. It will be between you and the company that you have the contract with.