Training Repayment (No Agreement)

JamesBond12

Afternoon,

I left an organisation around 20 months ago now and as I was in the middle of a Level 4 CIPS course I had to make a repayment which I had my current employer agree to cover and put me in a new handcuff agreement. I have since completed level 4 and moved onto level 5. Due to a number of reasons I have handed my notice in to my current employer. Now, I agree that I have to pay back a sum for the level 4 agreement as this has a sliding scale. However, when I started level 5 no new handcuff agreement was put in place nor any discussions held to state that I would be accountable to pay these fees back. It is only until I have handed in my notice they have threatened to make me pay a substantial figure.

My offer letter states "We will fund CIPS qualification through to level 6 (which will be subject to a separate training handcuff agreement)".
My separate level 4 handcuff agreement states "for the avoidance of doubt the sum of £ is intended to cover the following: Completion of CIPS Level 4 Diploma in Procurement and Supply". It has no reference to Level 5 whatsoever.

The company handbook has a section on training that states: "In the event that you attend external training for the improvement of your skills or professional development, you may be required to sign a Training Agreement to Fund Study contract that allows the COMPANY NAME to recover part / all of the cost of the training should you terminate your employment within an agreed period. You shall be advised of any such requirement before training shall commence".

As the original handcuff was to assist in the transfer of one organisation to another I accepted this but it was not made apparent any costs from Level 5 would be required.

There is no deduction clause in my contract and as I haven't signed or been made aware of the costs for Level 5 I am arguing the case.

I have asked the MD to provide me a copy of the signed Level 5 agreement and as there isn't one, he cannot provide this to me. They are threatening to deduct the money from my salary this month and my final salary next month.

I have sent the MD and HR Manager a letter stipulating my position and the lack of signed documentation, they have suggested that they will seek legal advice on this.

I would appreciate it if anyone on here could provide any advice on next steps.

Dox

If you don't want to pay for your own legal advice, try ACAS's helpline, or just wait and see what your current employer comes back with after they have taken legal advice.

Undervalued

You are right that there must be a clear agreement in place for training fees to be recoverable. Just putting something in a company handbook is not generally sufficient. On the face of it, but depending on the exact wording of what agreements you have signed, they would struggle to enforce this. It may well be that their legal advice with tell them as much.

However you can't stop them from deducting from your final pay, right down to zero, if they decide to do so and leave you to take action against them to recover the money. You may well win but nobody can force them to give you a decent reference or indeed one at all.

spadoosh

I think it would be unusual for a company to have a specific agreement for a specific course.

We keep ours simple, pretty much you will be charged for any expenses incurred as a result of training costs if you leave employment (on a sliding scale).

At least morally speaking i think youre pulling a fast one. To get an employer to cover your previous employers training costs so you where able to accept the job to then try and weasel out of an arrangement on a techinicality especially when you consider the chances of such a conversation taking place verbally is disingenuous.

Youre exactly the reason why such 'handcuff' agreements are used.

Id hope that the implication from the original agreement and the employee handbook information would be sufficient enough to suggest that you knew you would be paying for training. As such would be found liable for the monies owed.

DontBringBertie

“You are right that there must be a clear agreement in place for training fees to be recoverable. Just putting something in a company handbook is not generally sufficient.”

Surely if you sign a contract which references having ‘read and understood the employee handbook’ then it would be sufficient?

sangie595

DontBringBertie wrote: »

“You are right that there must be a clear agreement in place for training fees to be recoverable. Just putting something in a company handbook is not generally sufficient.”

Surely if you sign a contract which references having ‘read and understood the employee handbook’ then it would be sufficient?

No it isn't. For a lot of things it might be. But for training repayments it's clear cut - the training agreement must be specific to the course, explain the cost and the repayment terms, and must be presented and signed before the course is undertaken.

DontBringBertie

Interesting, didn’t know that.

I had a similar situation in my first job (with CIPS as well). It was mentioned in the handbook that any training or professional qualifications above £x in total had to be paid back on a sliding scale.

Luckily the company never bothered pursuing it in the end. Would have been £1,500 to pay back!

JamesBond12

Thank you for your response, I did forget to mention that before I started the course I asked on more than one occasion whether I needed to sign a new agreement and the response I received initially was "I'll speak to HR", the second time I asked the response was "no" but clearly this can't be relied on as this was simply a conversation.

sangie595

DontBringBertie wrote: »

Interesting, didn’t know that.

I had a similar situation in my first job (with CIPS as well). It was mentioned in the handbook that any training or professional qualifications above £x in total had to be paid back on a sliding scale.

Luckily the company never bothered pursuing it in the end. Would have been £1,500 to pay back!

It's an error that I did see from time to time in the private sector. It's a long time since I've seen it in the public sector. But then, they had a long history of providing a very wide range of professional and personal development courses. Not so much now, as they generally only support essential post qualifying courses. Interestingly, in my experience, they have always been tough on repayments too- I have never known a single one of them to give as much as an inch on the repayment terms.

Undervalued

spadoosh wrote: »

I think it would be unusual for a company to have a specific agreement for a specific course.

We keep ours simple, pretty much you will be charged for any expenses incurred as a result of training costs if you leave employment (on a sliding scale).

At least morally speaking i think youre pulling a fast one. To get an employer to cover your previous employers training costs so you where able to accept the job to then try and weasel out of an arrangement on a techinicality especially when you consider the chances of such a conversation taking place verbally is disingenuous.

Youre exactly the reason why such 'handcuff' agreements are used.

Id hope that the implication from the original agreement and the employee handbook information would be sufficient enough to suggest that you knew you would be paying for training. As such would be found liable for the monies owed.

Well it would be interesting to see if a court found your "simple" agreement sufficient. I rather suspect that if properly challenged it would not be. The rules are quite specific and it is one of a relatively few situations where a general "catch all" clause is not enough.

You are entitled to your opinion about morality. The alternative view is that the employer should do things properly.