Private Access Road, SE London (London Parking Sols)

Tarian

Dear All,

I've read the Newbies thread.
Sadly, I've lost track of which piece of advice applies at which stage#.

In June I received a "Parking Charge Notice to Registered Keeper".
Thinking it was a scam I ignored the claim,.

Later I received a letter from "Ultimate Car Solutions", Hove (describing themselves as "debt resolutions specialists").
Again, I assumed part of the scam.
.
In August, CBS Solicitors wrote saying "our Client may instruct us to take legal action".

Recently, CBS Sols. sent something headed "Letter of Claim".
It includes:
"Unless we receive a response from you or receive payment in full on or before DD/MM/YY, Court proceedings may be taken against you."
Is this the same as a "Letter Before County Court Claim" or Letter Before Action"?

The location is unfamiliar to me.
Apparently it is a short, private road running parallel to a main road giving access to a dozen or so houses.

It is possible that the driver turned off the main road into this parallel road and drove along it briefly before driving off in the opposite direction.

Is it too late to "appeal" to London Parking Solutions ?
i.e. asking for photos, the exact time and duration of the alleged "offence".

Is there any point in asking who the landowner is? (Clearly not a proper "business").

Should CSB Solicitors be replied to ?
And if so, with how much of a "defence" ?

Thanks very much


# The info and advice here has been maintained by some dedicated fighters for fairness and is much appreciated.
For a newbie, it can be hard to keep track of which piece of info / advice - or which template letter applies to which stage.
Please consider whether more "signposting" might avoid "Newbie posts" - perhaps a combination of HEADERS and paragraph numbers ??
Thanks very much

Half_way

Please see my post at:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5909803/private-access-road-se-london-london-parking-sols&highlight=

No one has commented yet.

Apparently the keeper stopped briefly in an unfamiliar private road in running parallel to an unfamiliar main road in SE London and saw no "contract" signs.

It turns out that some signs are present - from London Parking Solutions;
- Some at an odd angle
- Mostly in a small font and dense text

A) Statutory Guidance for public highways has certain requirements - incl. the ability to read and absorb content in a limited time

P of A 2012 provides for Regulation on signage on privat land - but no Regs seems to exist (yet)

how long was the brief stop? less than 10 minutes, 10 minute? more?

Coupon-mad

Is it too late to "appeal" to London Parking Solutions ?

Yes. So what? Not a reason to ever pay such scumbags.

i.e. asking for photos, the exact time and duration of the alleged "offence".

That's a Subject Access Request (SAR, not an appeal) and you an do that anytime, and yes, you need to put one in now. See their Privacy page, if they have one, for the contact details/email of their Data Protection Officer or team that will handle a SAR.

Is there any point in asking who the landowner is? (Clearly not a proper "business").

No. But Land Registry will tell you for £3.50 or so.

Should CSB Solicitors be replied to ?
And if so, with how much of a "defence" ?

Reply and deny knowing anything about it and tell them to put all data processing on hold as you wish them to restrict processing while their client replies to your SAR, supplies all data and images and evidences their timings.

Does the driver or passenger have Google location on their phone? Might well show that the timings that typical private parking scammers have made up are (perhaps) not true... ask them. On pepipoo we've just seen another one where the ANPR camera timings alleged more than 11 minutes on site, and yet Google maps show the person was only there for a mere 8 minutes. The difference between getting a PCN and not getting one.

Tarian

Half_way wrote: »

how long was the brief stop? less than 10 minutes, 10 minute? more?

Thanks for replying.

Apparently the stop could have been under a minute - but certainly no more than two minutes.

Half_way

You must find out why a parking charge notice was issued in the first place, dip you still have access to the original paperwork?
If not put the SAR in NOW

Tarian

Coupon-mad wrote: »

That's a Subject Access Request (SAR, not an appeal) and you an do that anytime, and yes, you need to put one in now. See their Privacy page, if they have one, for the contact details/email of their Data Protection Officer or team that will handle a SAR.


No. But Land Registry will tell you for £3.50 or so.

Reply and deny knowing anything about it and tell them to put all data processing on hold as you wish them to restrict processing while their client replies to your SAR, supplies all data and images and evidences their timings.

Does the driver or passenger have Google location on their phone? Might well show that the timings that typical private parking scammers have made up are (perhaps) not true... ask them. On pepipoo we've just seen another one where the ANPR camera timings alleged more than 11 minutes on site, and yet Google maps show the person was only there for a mere 8 minutes. The difference between getting a PCN and not getting one.

Thanks for your reply.

You appear to be suggesting that I make two replies, a substantive one to the PPC (LPS) - and a short one to CSB Solicitors.
Elsewhere on this Forum it was suggested that following a Letter of Claim, a full request for evidence and justification etc be sent to the solicitors sending the LofC.

Sadly the driver does not have Google location.
I am 99% certain there is no ANPR or CCTV.

Here is my Draft.
>>>>
Your Client: London Parking Solutions

Dear Sirs,

I am in receipt of your Letter of Claim dated XX October 2018.


The delay in replying was because this appeared to be a scam.

The letter received does not provide sufficient detail of the claim.
It does not provide any evidence. It merely asserts that there is a debt.
The inference is that someone parked a car in a part of XY Road deemed “Private”.


Therefore please obtain from your client:
a). An explanation of the cause of action

b) Whether they are pursuing me as driver or keeper


c) Whether they are relying on the provisions of Schedule 4 of POFA 2012


d) What the details of the claim are ? e.g.
i) where it is claimed the car was parked
ii) for how long, and the means by which this is recorded
iii) how the monies being claimed arose and have been calculated
iv) what contractual breach (if any) is being claimed


Please provide photographic evidence of i) and ii)
Please provide a plan showing i)

e) A copy of the contract with the landowner under which your client asserts authority to bring the claim, including a plan showing the area covered by the presumed contract

f). A copy of any alleged contract with the driver ... and/or keeper (is this bit wise?)

g). Details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed),including a plan showing where any signs were displayed.

h). If the client has added anything on to the original charge, what that represents and how it has been calculated.


i) Whether / Is the claim for trespass and consequential damage? If so , please provide details.


I note from the Procedure Rules that you signposted, that Para. 4.1 says
“the debtor should request copies of any documents they wish to see”.
To which I would qualify, “alleged” debtor.
<<<<


Is there any mileage,now or later, in checking for Planning Consent for signs?
I believe at least one sign is on a council lamp post.

Thanks again

Coupon-mad

You can do it that way if you prefer, but I prefer a SAR to the Parking firm themselves.

A solicitor can fob you off with half the info, whereas an actual SAR has a legal meaning under the DPA and the parking firm's Data Protection officer has to provide everything held about you/the car/all photos and really show their hand.

Tarian

Coupon-mad wrote: »

You can do it that way if you prefer, but I prefer a SAR to the Parking firm themselves.

A solicitor can fob you off with half the info, whereas an actual SAR has a legal meaning under the DPA and the parking firm's Data Protection officer has to provide everything held about you/the car/all photos and really show their hand.

That makes sense.

Thanks very much.
I will adjust accordingly.

(I'm inclined to assume that lack of other comment suggests that I have asked for everything I should ask for .... and nothing I shouldn't. Thanks again)