Help needed please

NellySmellyBelly

Hi everyone,
A newbie so please be nice :-)

Hubby has/had a SIPP being administred by James Hay Partnership from an ex-employer, started in 2004 It had £8,000 contributions placed in it over the few years he worked for the company.

On leaving the company's employment in 2008 he started to receive annual statements which showed very little growth through interest at the bank rate and a decline in the 'pot' through James Hay's admin fees being deducted.

Approximately 2011 after receiving the annual statement we contacted James Hay to ask to close the plan down, we were advised at the time that it had to be done through a financial advisor. We were at a bad point in our lives then and had no money to pay for an advisor so did not persue this.

Fast forward to 2014 we moved house and informed JH by letter (along with every other pension provider/utility/bank etc) and thought no more about it.

Fast forward to 2018 we receive a solicitors letter saying we owe JH £650 and threatening court action. After a long drawn out process (which I won't bore you with now) it seems that JH claim to have not received our letter of a change of address and have emptied the fund to pay the admin fees.

I understand (thanks to the Pensions Ombundsman) that it is entirely our fault as we did not realise that JH had not received/actioned our letter.

But it is infuriating that JH can charge £650 a year in admin fees, thus emptying the pot, when as far as we can see there was no admin, other than an annual letter which they have not sent due to the Gone Away in 2014 from our previous address. What really bugs me is they did a DWP trace in Nov 2014 (and took the money out of the pot) so will have known our new address then.

Any advice anyone can offer to complain about the fees - possible maladministration?

Thanks in advance

dunstonh

But it is infuriating that JH can charge £650 a year in admin fees, thus emptying the pot, when as far as we can see there was no admin, other than an annual letter which they have not sent due to the Gone Away in 2014 from our previous address.

Staff costs?
Administration costs?
Regulatory costs?
rates?
operating costs?

Any advice anyone can offer to complain about the fees - possible maladministration?

Where have they breached their published tariff?

NellySmellyBelly

So, will they continue to charge an annual admin fee, even though there is no money left in the plan?

I do apologise if this is a stupid questiion but neither of us are financial consultants or particularly informed on pensions, now ask me about PFC or pre-decimal coins and I would be able to answer your questions politely.

BTW we are trying to close the plan down and withdraw the £22.00 left in but are struggling with lack of information and tardiness (in my opinion) from JH

dunstonh

So, will they continue to charge an annual admin fee, even though there is no money left in the plan?

Correct. It is a SIPP. Not a stakeholder pension or a personal pension. Not that the charges on an SHP or PPP would erode a value down to zero or beyond but technically, they would end on zero value.

It is also a Full SIPP with explicit charges. Pretty much one of the most advanced pension products you can buy and a provider that typically caters for the specialist market (more often than not).

I do apologise if this is a stupid questiion but neither of us are financial consultants or particularly informed on pensions, now ask me about PFC or pre-decimal coins and I would be able to answer your questions politely.

Which does beg the question on how he ended up on such an advanced option.

TW we are trying to close the plan down and withdraw the £22.00 left in but are struggling with lack of information and tardiness (in my opinion) from JH

They are normally very good but they are not your normal basic retail option. They are geared to cater for a certain type of customer. Hence my question on how you ended up there. Was it choice? Was it a professional recommendation? etc

atush

trnsfer the 22.00 to your current pension.

Brynsam

NellySmellyBelly wrote: »

What really bugs me is they did a DWP trace in Nov 2014 (and took the money out of the pot) so will have known our new address then.

DWP traces are notoriously useless and often simply confirm the out of date address (and in some cases an even earlier one!). Had JH had your up to date address from using the tracing service, they would have written to your husband at that address.

NellySmellyBelly

They are normally very good but they are not your normal basic retail option. They are geared to cater for a certain type of customer. Hence my question on how you ended up there. Was it choice? Was it a professional recommendation? etc[/QUOTE]

It was all done through the Financial Director of his previous employer, which is a whole different story.

Lesson learnt for him, do NOT sign anything, particularly when you are presented with just the page to sign I guess

dunstonh

Some people come to this site and moan that employer schemes are too basic and they want more advanced options. They have to be reminded that most employees are not able to handle the more advanced options.

Maybe we should remember this thread next time we get someone moaning about their workplace scheme being basic (as in one where what has happened to you cannot happen).

In your case, that employer put you in a really advanced option that was almost certainly unsuitable. Unfortunately, unless it was put in place by a financial adviser, under advice, you have no comeback on suitability.

Don't let this put you off pensions. If you think about pensions as if they were vehicles, you can get simple vehicles and more advanced vehicles. You needed a simple vehicle like a bike or maybe a car. You were given helicopter. So, remember next time you look at pensions that they are not all the same and you can get simple and don't want complicated. And if in doubt, a local IFA can always do it for you.

zagfles

And people say HL are expensive at 0.45%!! How did you end up with a SIPP which charges close to 10% of the value in fees??

Suggest you have a chat with the pensions advisory service (it's free): https://www.pensionsadvisoryservice.org.uk

Alexland

This does raise an interesting question of if they truly treated the customer fairly in terms of having an adequate internal review process to ensure their products were delivering good customer outcomes.

There seems to be an over reliance on pointing the customer to their terms and conditions while happily draining their pot completely dry. While they can't change what happened they could accept it was clearly an unfortunate situation for which they do not deserve to profit and suggest a compromise.