Annual leave during notice period

Richard_Z

Hello all,

I've recently resigned (1 month's notice) from my job but I was expecting to not work the last week as I've been told by the HR department that I still have got 5 days left to use. My manager has been on holiday and I've been told by the HR that he needs to authorize the 5 days first. So he's now returned and I've spoken to him also explaining that I'm actually leaving the country and my tenancy contract is coming to an end so if I'm forced to work on the last 5 days I will have to stay in a hotel.

He's said that I have told him on too short notice. I've spoken to HR on 03/09/18 regarding my holidays and my last day is supposed to be on 01/10/2018. But If I take my 5 days left, my last day is now on 24/09/2018.
My manager said that he's not keen in giving me the last week as I'm still training the new employee, however I feel that it's not my fault that he was on holiday and to be honest due to the nature of the job one week won't make much difference in terms of new employee training, that job takes months to learn and I've actually offered myself to support remotely if required.


I would like to leave in good terms but having to stay in a hotel is going to be a bit of pain and my wife will be bored as she has been granted her last week off.


Can the employer actually force me to accept payment in lieu of holidays?

KiKi

In short - yes. They can dictate when you take your annual leave.

If I were you, I'd apologise for making assumptions, beg for their understanding, and offer a way of enabling a better handover. Eg, let me take the 5 days as AL, and I'll work late on these days to write all the handover notes etc...that's the best you can hope for.

It's not your fault he was on holiday; but it's not his fault you made an assumption about your notice period, either. His holiday isn't your problem, but your tenancy / hotel needs are not his problem. It works both ways.

Compromising is your best bet - esp if you need a good reference.
KiKi

restless6

I wanted five day AL but was only allowed 2 when I left my job - even though I had plenty available - which they still haven’t paid me for !

Richard_Z

KiKi wrote: »

In short - yes. They can dictate when you take your annual leave.

If I were you, I'd apologise for making assumptions, beg for their understanding, and offer a way of enabling a better handover. Eg, let me take the 5 days as AL, and I'll work late on these days to write all the handover notes etc...that's the best you can hope for.

It's not your fault he was on holiday; but it's not his fault you made an assumption about your notice period, either. His holiday isn't your problem, but your tenancy / hotel needs are not his problem. It works both ways.

Compromising is your best bet - esp if you need a good reference.
KiKi

Thanks. Actually I don't need a reference in the UK as I don't plan to return, also I have got my promotion letter from 2 years ago which is also good. However I might work for the same group on a different country but on a consultancy basis, they might or might not ask for references. But I have specific technical knowledge abut the products which are certainly valuable to them. I'm also valuable in the UK because I've recently found out that I'm "cheap" that's why they are not happy for me to leave but like I said, 1 week won't make much difference. I have got a work laptop, I can offer myself to work from home but all I can do is just to tweak the instructions for my replacement.

Savvy_Sue

Richard_Z wrote: »

I have got a work laptop, I can offer myself to work from home but all I can do is just to tweak the instructions for my replacement.

But if you're leaving the country, how will you return it?

Richard_Z

Savvy_Sue wrote: »

But if you're leaving the country, how will you return it?

That's whilst I'm still in the country I can work after 6 pm for example, but anyway I can also support using teamviewer or using email or over the phone.

Anyway I've decided to waive the holidays and work the last week because they are quite tied up with extra work and 2 more people are abandoning the ship. The place is being poorly managed, however the company has invested in a lot of training for the benefit of both sides and they said they could ask me to repay the costs. I did not dispute that even knowing that I have good chances of winning the case because there's no written agreement and I'm not using my specific training to work for a competitor. Even if I lost, the CCJ would not be enforceable abroad. Despite this, I have decided that I will not let them down, a week won't make much difference but at least I will leave in good terms and I will feel morally better.


Thanks everyone.

System

And if he doesn't authorise it, make it known that they will have to pay you those five days after you leave...

Richard_Z

andydownes123 wrote: »

And if he doesn't authorise it, make it known that they will have to pay you those five days after you leave...

They have acknowledged it by letter fortunately.

Actually I would take advantage to ask something: the contract states that when signed, the employee confirms that he/she as received an employee handbook and then there is a separate sheet to provide next of kin details with another statement something like this "the employee handbook is part of the contract etc..."
but actually I was never given an employee handbook. I've asked other colleagues and nobody has ever received an employee handbook. But obviously everybody signs the contract assuming the handbook will be given shortly thereafter in good faith but I think that nobody wants to seem fussy like "hey I won't sign that contract until I see that employee handbook" and people just end up not asking for it.

Possible scenario: If they had decided to enforce the training refund rule by taking me to court to repay back the costs, could I use this as defence? They claim there is a rule regarding repaying training expenses but I have been made aware of it. No other employee (except line managers) is aware of it.

sangie595

Richard_Z wrote: »

They have acknowledged it by letter fortunately.

Actually I would take advantage to ask something: the contract states that when signed, the employee confirms that he/she as received an employee handbook and then there is a separate sheet to provide next of kin details with another statement something like this "the employee handbook is part of the contract etc..."
but actually I was never given an employee handbook. I've asked other colleagues and nobody has ever received an employee handbook. But obviously everybody signs the contract assuming the handbook will be given shortly thereafter in good faith but I think that nobody wants to seem fussy like "hey I won't sign that contract until I see that employee handbook" and people just end up not asking for it.

Possible scenario: If they had decided to enforce the training refund rule by taking me to court to repay back the costs, could I use this as defence? They claim there is a rule regarding repaying training expenses but I have been made aware of it. No other employee (except line managers) is aware of it.

No that is no defence of anything. You have a mouth? You could have asked for the handbook.

On the other hand, a good defence might be that if you haven't signed a separate training agreement, then it's not enforceable.

Savvy_Sue

In brief, repaying training expenses can only be enforced if there is a signed agreement to that effect, ie in addition to any contract. So if it's not spelled out in whatever you were given, I'd say they can't be reclaimed, but ... IANAL and I haven't seen whatever you signed ...

Richard_Z

I've been told that there is a general clause applicable to training and repayments. They've actually paid for an HND but there is no written agreement. They simply offered me the course for the benefit of both sides and I have accepted it and this was discussed behind closed doors, no agreement has been signed.