Anxiety & Depression - Fraudulently claiming sick pay

Marcon

FBaby wrote: »

I suspect it is what they think you've done though with your last sickness record considering you mention growing issues requesting time off to take her daughter to appointment. I expect they indeed intend to use whatever evidence they have that you're not really ill, and that you are using that sick leave to look after your daughter.

They don't have to prove this is the case but still would have to prove in court that they had enough evidence to have reached that conclusion, so would be interesting to know what 'evidence' they think they have.

This won't be going anywhere near a court. There is already plenty of evidence that both GP and OH have confirmed OP is not fit t work, so posting this sort of comment, although possibly accurate in many respects, is rather alarmist, especially for someone reading it in a fragile mental state.

Les79

Marcon wrote: »

This won't be going anywhere near a court. There is already plenty of evidence that both GP and OH have confirmed OP is not fit t work, so posting this sort of comment, although possibly accurate in many respects, is rather alarmist, especially for someone reading it in a fragile mental state.

I bet that the disciplinary process being initiated is also "rather alarmist" for OP too.

Sadly, there are sometimes things which need to be said/done irrespective of whether or not someone is in a "fragile mental state".

One thing I'd like to know is whether OP submitted a flexible working request with their employer as soon as they realised that their daughter was unwell and more time was needed to be dedicated to her. Sounds like this may not have been done (or was declined) and OP was running themselves into the ground, with the employer getting frustrated with the consequences of that. Not backing the employer up like, but maybe more could have been done on OP's end?

sangie595

Marcon wrote: »

This won't be going anywhere near a court. There is already plenty of evidence that both GP and OH have confirmed OP is not fit t work, so posting this sort of comment, although possibly accurate in many respects, is rather alarmist, especially for someone reading it in a fragile mental state.

How on earth could you possibly know that? There is, possibly, a lot of evidence that the GP and OH have been conned! Stress and anxiety are easy to fake, and you have no idea what evidence the employer thinks they have. So the comment is accurate in all respects, and not at all alarmist. Even people in fragile states do not appreciate being lied to. If you want opinions given through rose tinted spectacles, you ask your friends. People who post here deserve the truth. This is the truth.

Fbaby is correct... An allegation of this type is exceptionally unusual. Very few employers would suggest that they think sick leave is fraudulent, even when they have a very good idea, or even some evidence, that it is! There are easier ways to skin a cat. And if the union are any good, they are also going to tell the OP all this. Telling members convenient lies isn't fair, and they need to understand that there are no guarantees when things are this bad. Someone, or something, has led the employer to believe there may be truth to a very serious allegation. Given that they know that the OP had a disabled child, and that disability discrimination by association is a real risk, they aren't going to go to such lengths as this on a whim. None of that means it is true - but it does mean that they have come into possession of something that needs explaining.

DayDreamer2018

My reasons for being on the sick is due to a build up of emotions and concerns arising from work and the way I feel I’ve been treated. This in turn has had an adverse effect on my family life and mental state of mind.

As mentioned there were initial difficulties with my daughter that were under control but informed work straight away when it started to effect my lateness.

I did look into requesting flexible working hours, but I opted to take 1 week of parental leave (upcoming) to spend more time with my daughter and weigh up my options. (My next case management meeting has been put in the Callander for in that week!)

My biggest concern is the fact that whilst I’ve been on the sick I have been helping my step father with his gardening business (unpaid) as a means of doing something, keeping me busy and having someone to talk which was advised to be ok by the GP and OH.

Is this something they would be claiming as fraudulent?

Undervalued

DayDreamer2018 wrote: »

My reasons for being on the sick is due to a build up of emotions and concerns arising from work and the way I feel I!!!8217;ve been treated. This in turn has had an adverse effect on my family life and mental state of mind.

As mentioned there were initial difficulties with my daughter that were under control but informed work straight away when it started to effect my lateness.

I did look into requesting flexible working hours, but I opted to take 1 week of parental leave (upcoming) to spend more time with my daughter and weigh up my options. (My next case management meeting has been put in the Callander for in that week!)

My biggest concern is the fact that whilst I!!!8217;ve been on the sick I have been helping my step father with his gardening business (unpaid) as a means of doing something, keeping me busy and having someone to talk which was advised to be ok by the GP and OH.

Is this something they would be claiming as fraudulent?

Quite possibly I'm afraid.

Although doing something like that or indeed going away could well be beneficial for your condition it can very easily be misunderstood. You should certainly have cleared it with your employer first.

It is possible for somebody with two part time jobs to be off sick from one but fit for the other under certain circumstances but that too needs very careful handling.

I would strongly suggest you get your doctor to write a letter to support what you have been doing.

An employer is not obliged to accept lateness as a result of family illness, beyond the extent that could reasonably be covered by the right to carers leave. Many employer do in fact show great flexibility when an employee has serious family issues. However, they do not have to do so beyond the limited protection of the law. Equally they do not have to continue any flexibility they have extended indefinitely.

sangie595

Yes, I think that you need to think about putting things into "two piles". It's not acceptable to be continually late for work. It doesn't matter what your reason is - it's simply not acceptable. Equally, it's quite reasonable for an employer to expect a partner to carry some responsibility for hospital appointments - being unable to drive is not a reason for not doing so, as there are other alternatives, and especially so if the partner isn't in employment.

So there are things in your account of your treatment that you may not like, but which aren't wrong. You can't blame your employer for your stress in not liking things that are entirely "fair" in law. So what is it that you think isn't fair? Because that's the root - what could be changed that would make it possible to satisfy your employers requirements (after all, they employ you to do that, and anything outside that is not their concern really), and is there any way that you can reach a compromise?

In the end, blunt as it may be, you have had 7 weeks off sick. There is likely to be as many more off sick. That's three months - a quarter of a year. You've also had attendance issues. And lateness issues. And unpaid leave (it might be unpaid, but it's still absence). From their point of view, how would this look to you? Like a reliable employee? I'm not saying that the employer is perfect. But there are two sides to every story, and theirs is that they are an employer and employ people to do a job. Full stop.

So yes, if they've found out that you've been working, unpaid or not, then that may well have been the last straw. You can't do your job, but you can work in a gardening business? Rationally, how does that sound to you?

So I did think that you need to decide what about this job you can suck up, how you can manage to do that, and whether that is what you want. If you want this job, if you really want it, because it's good pay and a larger company, then you can ask them for some adjustments, but it's you that needs to make the biggest move. You have to get to work on time. You need to reduce absences, if necessary by arranging flexible working or cutting your working week so that you have time to do things in the family.

None of that solves the current problem, but until you know what that problem is, there's little to be done about it. But it isn't the only problem, and this will continue to eat at you unless you can solve the bigger picture. I think the employer does need to look at that and what they might do. But in the end, most of the effort would need to come from you. Reasonable adjustments are not an obligation. They must consider them. They do not have to give them.

motorguy

DayDreamer2018 wrote: »

Hi, firstly let me apologise. I have read quite a few threads in here and understand that some of the questions may of already been answered, but I also know that each persons situation is different and may require differenlty constructed answers.

This is my 7th week on sick from work (Second sick note) and I have just received a letter stating that an investigation is being conducted into fraudulently claiming sick pay and using sickness absense to frustrate internal processes.

I currently suffer with anxiety and depression, I understand that so many people can easily use this as a scapegoat to get time off work, but believe me the way I feel is horrible and I wouldn’t wish this on anyone!

If I’m honest my condition started when my daughter was born disabled. It hit me like a tonne of bricks and I kinda fell into a awful part of my life. I eventually got my head out the sand and began to feel good again. My daughter has had to undergo a lot of Physio sessions, plastic surgeries, consultations... etc. I have used work holiday days to attend doc appointments and such in the past just so I didn’t take any additional days off work. Previously managers have been good in that sense and so I’ve returned the gesture.
Over the past couple of years managers and senior staff have recognised the work I’ve done, requesting progression plans for me, the works! I’ve taken work home with me, led teams, presented work to directors and was even promoted to a stand in staff role. Then due to demanning I had to return to my old position, but I was given a made up role because the manager knew I could do more. I done the work the manager and senior staff wanted me to whilst not being paid accordingly.
I have been given promises of false hope continuously, told that if I want to move on with my career I have to be seen to be doing all this work. Using and abusing me.

With my daughter things have started to get worse. Additional concerns have arisen. She is awake throughout the night in pain which has throughout the year made me late to work on a number of occasions triggering attendance and lateness procedures, which I fully understand. We have requested further help from the GP, OH, PT, and other doctors who have now put positive actions things into motion. Meanwhile when I’ve requested to take the day off work to take my daughter to hospital for PT & OH I was scrutinised as to why it was me who had to go and why couldn’t my wife get a taxi (she doesn’t drive). I had to speak to the supervisor first who carried messages back to me from the manager (who sat opposite me!) finally I was informed that I could take the day off unpaid as requested (The union put their nose in) That’s just one small example how over the past 2 years I’ve been made to feel so low about myself, now my anxiety has built up where I’m scared to ask for time off to look after my disabled daughter.

I’ve applied for over 30 internal vacancies in 2 years, I’ve had a handful of interviews, of which I’ve not been successful. I’ve requested feedback from these but have yet to hear back! One supervisor laughed at me when I physically asked him when I would be receiving feedback. Another role was given to a guy who I trained to do that role, which I previously stood in for!

There’s been another demanning at work and because my service is lowers than others around me I’ve had to move jobs regardless of my in house experience and skill set. Jane doe next to me has worked in the area for 5 mins with zero skill set yet gets to remain.

I have been moved to a job which I strongly believe has zero use for the skills and knowledge I have obtained, I have struggled on the job since being placed there.

My sleeping pattern became irregular and most nights not more than 2-3 hours.
My anxiety is through the roof constantly panicking about every situation, confrontation and the simplest of tasks.
I’ve sank in to a bad depression where I believe that I’m simply not good enough. As a father, as an employee and as a husband to my wife.
My GP initially signed me off work with stress but has now changed my diagnosis to anixety.
I have been to see the OH nurse at work twice now who has put into writing that I am unfit to work.
I have contacted IAPT who again have said the same and have put me on a waiting list.
Work in the meantime have arranged further OH and CBT meetings.

My first case management meeting went terribly wrong. I was on time waiting. I text and called the number of the manager who didn’t reply for over 40 mins - he said he didn’t have his phone on him. We had the meeting 45 mins later than intended.

Today I have received a letter stating work are in the process of conducting and investigation into fraudulently claiming sick payand using sickness absence to frustrate internal processes, to which I am horrified?! I’m scared and my anxiety is terrible.

Can anyone help advise what I should do?

All of personal history countrs for nothing if you've been caught working whilst declaring yourself not fit for work - which it seems like you have....