Issue getting past final interviews stages...

shortcrust

If you're ever asking someone for a reference you should find out what it's going to say, or at least whether it's positive or negative, rather than crossing your fingers and hoping for the best. Ask them to send you a copy next time you use them or be direct and ask what they will say.

TBagpuss

dg01 wrote: »

thanks for your reply. How honest can they be talking to m potential future employers? As it never went through disciplinary. I officially resigned before the first disciplinary meeting.

I thought HR was only allowed to give, times you worked there and if you showed up. All issues that happened shouldn't be said should it? I didn't give a reason on my resignation letter.

Im in UK by the way if that makes any difference

No, they have an obligation to be truthful. Many organisations chose to give a factual reference only as they don't want to risk being dragged into allegations of whether or not they were truthful, or don't want to pend the time giving greater detail.


However, you employer could, enitrely properly and truthfully say
- that you resigned while under investigation for disciplinary issues
- that no, they would not re-hire you

That said, a lot of employers will only take up references once the job has been offered (which is why job offers are typically made ' subject to references'), as it is much more efficient.

In your post you say

But since my last employment, I have had interviews with around 20 or so different companies, each getting to the final stage but the end result is for each one... there was people with better and more experience.

That can't be just a coincidence?

Yes, it can. Things like saying that there was another candidate with more / better experience is a fairly standard reason to give to someone when you aren't taking them on. The rejection letter is probably a standard one which may then be slightly personalised, but there are only so many ways to say 'we had a different candidate who we felt was a better fit for the job'

dg01

Thanks for all your replies.

In regards to the references, I have 2 other references that relate to my career that would give an outstanding reference, I know and they have said they would. It is just this last employment one. I have't got a personal reference, I just put the main number of the office on the CV so they will get through to the HR department. I did email my manager a month ago to ask if he can further support me getting a role and he said it is not within the policy to provide personal references and all referencing must be done by HR.

You may not get a truthful answer. Or it might be that there are better candidates. But if you're not getting offers following interview rather than offers being retracted it's not the references that are the issue.

The above quote from elsien left me rather intrigued. So if I am turned down at the final interview stage, it is more likely going to be my experience rather than references as they didn't offer me the job then retracted it? The way I thought it happens was that after the final interview, if they think you're a suitable candidate they would get references before offering you the position, is that not always the case?

TBagpuss

It depends on the organisation.

The way we do it is that we would interview, decide which candidate we want and offer them the job, subject to references. Once they accept, we would contact their references and carry out the other checks.

If the references are not satisfactory we could then withdraw the offer.

Otherwise we would be asking for references for everyone who was shortlisted for a second / final interview, which is more work for our HR and for the referees. After all, we might offer someone a job and they could turn it down, in which case there would be no point us taking up their references.

Obviously other employers may do things in a different order, but I think the way we do it is pretty common. Certainly in the past when I have applied for jobs, my references have only been contacted after I was offered the job.

BorisThomson

I check references after the job has been offered and accepted (subject to checks).

The only check I'll do before offer is your social media accounts!

elsien

Also to add, that it was my company policy that references had to go through HR and I couldn't give someone a work reference in an individual capacity.
However I could write a personal reference using my home address as long as I made it very clear that it was not a work reference, was my personal opinion, nothing to do with the employer or the company and was not in their headed notepaper. Maybe that's an avenue to explore with previous manager. The company have no control over what someone does as a private individual in this respect, although it may be that they say no because they don't want to put themselves in an awkward position.

nicechap

dg01 wrote: »

....... Me and my team had lets say "cultural differences",

....... they decided to take me through disciplinary - most things were twisted .

....... so I am not telling employers or recruiters the above.

....... I was in the employment for 10 months ......

........That can't be just a coincidence?

........

So main questions are:
1) Is the HR department of my previous role allowed to give any information about what went on during my time there? If so, how much detail would they go in?

2) If they ask questions like "would you rehire?" and they say no based on the above, are they allowed to say why? This then puts me in a difficult position,,,

Thanks,
Dan

Q1 As much detail as they wish to as long as its truthful

Q2 Yes.

Was the disciplinary due to accusations of sexism or racism?

If you are lying to potential employers about why you left, I would suspect that vibe is being picked up in interviews.

sangie595

Comms69 wrote: »

Normally I agree with this. I'm currently applying for a new role and they've asked to take up references prior to interview - which I take as good sign to be fair!


It's the first time I've seen it happen this way, but thought I'd share an experience which goes against the grain somewhat

A number of employers do this to recruit faster. References are held by HR - or sealed by the manager. You make a decision, open that set of references, they're fine, offer made, confirmed and bingo. If not good references, you move to the next on the list!

theoretica

If you have good relationships with your other referees could you ask if they have been asked for references for you? That way you would know if it was a reference issue or not.

Do the interviewing companies know about your mental condition? If your personality differences are apparent in the interview and they don't know then they can't take it into account.

[Deleted User]

dg01 wrote: »

So if I am turned down at the final interview stage, it is more likely going to be my experience rather than references as they didn't offer me the job then retracted it? The way I thought it happens was that after the final interview, if they think you're a suitable candidate they would get references before offering you the position, is that not always the case?

You've had a job before, how did it work last time?

Granted references are a real mind-field.

What about employers who take people on without obtaining references is it 'fair' to then on asking that employer who didn't, for a reference 10 ten times over later on?

I think it is more hard to get a permanent job out there at the moment for what it's worth (more harder then it is to come by a FTC, temp to perm etc) and not be the 'middle candidate'.

I'm 3 weeks in a contract term job "subject to successful references" known literally just before starting. Some industries like aviation or care - understandably references are far more important, only this week I declined a job interview when the latter came back to me 7 weeks after applying for a 1 year post which required 5 years check able reference background and made clear it wasn't negotiable but it made things really easy on the weeding out who should turn up! I still don't think they struggled to get people attending.

My tip is get a few jobs behind you, then you won't ever really be 'interviewed' I'm not sure this is about references.