Verbal agreement - does it mean anything?

hollip0p

Hi all,

A friend of mine finished an apprenticeship earlier this year and was put on to shift from 1st June. It was verbally agreed between the three apprentices and their manager that they would all start on level 2 wages, but as soon as the college confirmed all their work was up to standard and they had passed, they would move on to level 3. It was agreed that when this was all signed off their level 3 pay would be backdated to 1st June. I think the logic behind this was that all the work was done, and it wasn't the apprentices fault if the college and employer took time to process.

The following e-mail was sent to them but I don't think it's very clear:

"As discussed, it was agreed that you could move onto shift level 2, moving on to level 3 once all information was signed off, which includes the NVQ. Therefore please use this mail as agreement to start shifts from 1st July. Contracts etc will follow from HR and I will ensure this is from 1st June 2017, and backdated to that date".

Everything has finally been signed off, and they've moved on to level 3 wages, but the manager is now saying he never agreed to the back pay element.

Do you think they have a leg to stand on or just need to accept what they are now being told?

Comms69

well they can ofcourse be dismissed if they kicked up a fuss - pick your battles

hollip0p

Comms69 wrote: »

well they can ofcourse be dismissed if they kicked up a fuss - pick your battles

Would that not be unfair dismissal...?

Comms69

hollip0p wrote: »

Would that not be unfair dismissal...?

Not with less than 2 years service.


Even after that, I suspect they'd find a reason if they really wanted to.

sharpe106

What is the difference? If they have it in writing from there manager ie the email then they could probably take it to HR or their manager managers but is it really worth it?, best case HR honour it but even if they do the chances are the manager will get into trouble over it and as they still have to work for them it would make an uncomfortable working environment and when it comes to review time the manager can easily say they have not the standard and get rid of them like that.

Whilst some managers are very good unfortunately a lot are not and are very petty and vindictive, if you make them look bad to the higher ups then they will find a way to get there own back. If it was me I liked the job I would just accept if I was thinking of leaving anyway then I might challenge it.

marcarm

What is the difference in £ for 1 month salary at L2 and L3?

As said, might be a case of picking your battles, as if it was say £100 difference, is it worth kicking up a fuss and possibly having your cards marked for that amount?

hollip0p

Thanks for the replies.

The difference works out to around £350 a month pre-tax, so it's a substantial difference.

I think maybe it's just a lesson learned going forwards, to make sure anything they agree is clearly documented somewhere so there is no confusion or awkwardness at a later date. Just disappointing from the manager.

agrinnall

Who is that email from? Is it from the manager who now says the increase won't be backdated? If so show it to him and ask why he said it.

mgdavid

OP, what is the difference between your 1st paragraph and the email you quote in para 2? I've read it 4 times and cannot see the problem but maybe I'm missing something?

hollip0p

agrinnall wrote: »

Who is that email from? Is it from the manager who now says the increase won't be backdated? If so show it to him and ask why he said it.

Yep from his manager. He is saying the email meant it would be backdated to level 2 pay, which doesn’t make sense to us.

hollip0p

mgdavid wrote: »

OP, what is the difference between your 1st paragraph and the email you quote in para 2? I've read it 4 times and cannot see the problem but maybe I'm missing something?

Paragraph 1 was what was agreed back in June. Para 2 is the email his manager sent after the conversation, also back in June.

The problem now is that the manager is saying he can’t temember agreeing to backdating to level 3 pay and is saying the email means backdating to level 2 pay...

Hope that makes sense!