How does bank "Balance it's books" at end of day?Always accurate?

Saver-upper · 23 November 2017 at 2:46PM

I hope someone can just reassure me a little.I am feeling a bit anxious.As well as curious.
A couple of weeks ago my partner gave me a wad of cash (that he had saved by getting rid of our secound car-no tax/insurance to pay).He said said to me "There is (I am sure he said £200) to go towards the children's Christmas presents".I set it aside,added £40 to it ,and waited for a chance to take it to the bank.
While standing in the bank queue yesterday,I felt in my handbag and counted the notes again.£240 in £20 notes.
When I got to the front of the queue,I said I wanted to put the money in my account.As usual,I was asked if I knew how much was there.(I am always asked this when I make a deposit).I said"Yes, £240".After she put the notes through her counter machine,it jammed.She asked me how much was there,I told her £240.Asked me if I was sure,I said yes,thatI had checked it again while standing in the queue.
When the machine jammed,£40 still hadn't gone through,so £200 should have gone through.She got a collegue,asked me again howmuch.I told her £240 total-£200 now in the machine,and £40 now sitting on the side....
The worker told me the machine was counting it as £400.I said "No,definitely £200."
So,yesterday it was left as they would credit my account with £240 that we all agree was there.Then they would balance the tills specially before opening this morning,and if there was £400-ish,they would credit it,and phone me (apparently Natwest,or this branch, only balance the tills once a week,on a Saturday.)
Late last night (because I wasn't worried about it),I casually mentioned to my partner the events of the day.Well,he said he gave me £400,£200 each for tax/insurance.
Now,I would just like to re-iterate,that I in no way believe my partner gave me £400.He is mistaken.I know there is no way a wad of £440,folded in half as it was,would even fit in my purse :eek:.
This morning I went back to the bank,and it was confirmed that everything balanced,it was £240,the £400 must have been from the previous transaction to me,sorry for the inconvenience,we know you knew you were so certian,there are people around who would have said "Oh,yeah,that's right.It was £440...."
So now I have text partner to say it was all balanced,I knew you had only given me £200.Nothing to worry about.And he hasn't answered.When he comes home tonight,he will either say "oh yes,I have gone through my statements,and it was only £200 I gave you",or,more likely,because he does have a dreadful memory, he will swear up and down that we have been ripped off :eek:.
So,if that happens,what do I say?When a bank balances the till,is it foolproof?How do they do it (eg when they count all the money that has been put in the counter machine,do they know who every £ came from?Is it because nobody elses transactions went wobbly this week that any discrepancy must be the last deposit?).I am curious how the system knows.
Sorry for the long post,though I do feel better getting it off my chest.I just started second-guessing myself,and want to be able to say to partner that systems are in place that a mistake couldn't happen.But what are the systems?
Thank you.

~Beanie~ · 23 November 2017 at 4:10PM

Simply answer is that the computer adds up the amount of cash that it thinks has been paid in, the cashier counts the physical cash - both should tally.

Why didn't that cashier count your cash manually? It isn't like there was thousands!

Saver-upper · 23 November 2017 at 4:27PM

Thank you Beanie,that is great.
Your question has always been one of the mysteries of my little world.I have banked with Natwest for 17 years,and,certainly for as long as I can remember,everytime I take in cash,I am asked "Do you know how much is here?".Sometimes they count it manually,other times,it gets put through this counter (seems to be only one between the 3 tills of this branch,so if it is handy,they must use it,I guess.I havent seen bank workers walk from other tills to get to it).
But yes,as to why I am always asked how much is there,I am a bit :think:.

trailingspouse · 23 November 2017 at 5:05PM

They ask you before they count it so that if they count, say £290, you can't say 'But there was £300!!!'

msallen · 23 November 2017 at 6:01PM

When you say "counter machine", do you mean a small device that sits on their desktop and just counts the cash, or a larger machine under their desk into which they deposit the cash (or withdraw from).

I'm assuming you mean the latter (called a teller cash recycler or TCR) as otherwise they would just have recounted it.

I work with these devices but I have never had any dealing with Natwest so what I'm telling you is typical practice but I can't swear thats how Natwest do it.

Normally the teller's banking application will produce a balance report at the end of the day which basically shows what they started the day with, the total amount (often per denomination) deposited/withdrawn and thus an expected end of day balance they hold.

In normal circumstances this is checked against their cash drawer by manually counting the contents but against the TCR by simply querying the TCR's contents. The actual contents of the TCR are only normally checked against what the software says they should have about every six months (because even then they are spot on 99.999% of the time so there's no need to do it any more often).

However if the TCR has had some sort of malfunction or serious jam that requires a technician to visit then depending on the nature of the malfunction, it may be emptied and physically checked. This is still pretty rare though as it doesn't just count the notes in once, it counts them into the slot at the top, then again at a number of points along their path before a final check at the destination cassette.

The point being that even if there was a jam, if the device says there was £200 (or £400 or whatever) then that is what there was.

However, there is some flaky application software out there, and it is just about possible that if the TCR experienced a particularly unusual malfunction that the application software had not been tested against, and happened very rarely, then the software may misinterpret the message about the transaction sent back from the TCR and report wrong details to the teller. If this were the case that might explain the apparent £200/£400 confusion in what the application software told the teller. However the details in the transaction journal should still be correct, hence the fact that the "extra £200" was corrected again in the end of day report.

PeacefulWaters · 23 November 2017 at 6:16PM

Put it this way, if a cashier has numerous disputed counter transactions against their name they're on the fiddle and the bank will sack them.

Saver-upper · 23 November 2017 at 11:01PM

msallen wrote: »

When you say "counter machine", do you mean a small device that sits on their desktop and just counts the cash, or a larger machine under their desk into which they deposit the cash (or withdraw from).

I'm assuming you mean the latter (called a teller cash recycler or TCR) as otherwise they would just have recounted it.

Hey,msallen thank you for such a detailed reply.That is exactly the sort of explanation I was looking for-"how the system works and (usually) can't go wrong".Yes,it was the latter.

jonesMUFCforever · 23 November 2017 at 11:59PM

OP may I suggest the next time your partner gives you money , you check it in front of him and agree a figure - it will save a lot of aggravation in future!