ParkingEye PCN, did not keep ticket for proof

EpicBox

On 6th August 2017 the driver paid for 1 hour in Holy Trinity Church car park in Newquay, Cornwall.

Today, September 2nd, the keeper received a parking charge notice for staying a total of 1 hour and 13 minutes. The PCN is dated 30th August. I am aware that this might help give some leverage as it took them more than 14 days to issue the charge notice.

I think one of the arguments to use in an appeal is that they are supposed to grant a grace period for the time taken to read the signs, pay, and leave afterwards. But since I disposed of the ticket, can I claim this without proof that the driver paid for that 1 hour?

Since I paid by cash, there is no bank statement for evidence. However, the driver did enter the car's registration into the machine.

Thanks in advance.

Redx

chances are the pcn is for an overstay, not non-payment

so if they are not saying that you failed to pay , its irrelevant becasue its likely they are alleging OVERSTAY (which is covered by clause #13 GRACE PERIODS in the BPA CoP)

and the POFA2012 failure is an extra appeal point

you could mention both these factors if you wish by ADDING to the blue text appeal (not altering it , but adding to it) - several examples of such an addition have been posted recently on here as overstays and POFA2012 failures are extremely common

do not name the driver or infer who it was (important)

choose KEEPER in their online appeal menu

in future , KEEP those paid for tickets for quite a while

why ? read this MSE report

http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/team-blog/2017/05/30/throwing-pay-display-ticket-away-use-cost-100/

Coupon-mad

Yup, whatever you do, ONLY choose 'registered keeper' not 'driver'.

You may as well use the template from the NEWBIES thread, it stops people saying who was driving. Sounds like you have a golden ticket from PE (search the forum!). You win!!

Guys_Dad

One point appeal. As keeper, they have failed to follow POFA. A NtK dated August 30th would be deemed to be delivered September 1st.

You don't need anything else. Get your POPLA code and keep it simple.

EpicBox

[Deleted text to preserve anonymity]

I also need to query this paragraph of the appeal template:

"Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offence, has caused significant distress to me. "

Well... they already have the registered keeper's details. The letter has my name on the front (me being the keeper), and it says on the back "The registered keeper details have been provided by the DVLA".

So, this paragraph strikes me as a bit redundant. Is there any benefit to me including that part?

Redx

edit the above to remove the idea of who did what

the correct terms are

THE DRIVER

THE KEEPER

PE have no idea of the details of the person who was driving , keep it that way

nover use the words "ME , MYSELF and I" if you can avoid it, this isnt an english exam , lol

the BPA CoP says nothing of the kind , please read clause #13

it has an unspecified period before the parking period, so that would be say 5 to 10 minutes , and a MINIMUM of 10 minutes to leave, so 15 minutes may be construed from those 2 paragraphs , but so could 21 minutes, or 16 minutes , so I err on the side of up to 21 minutes when I advise people, hence my post earlier

I also knew it wasnt about the ticket itself, as they would have been alleging an OVERSTAY

there is nothing "redundant" in that blue text appeal , people always want to alter it or remove it for some reason , even when we tell them to use it "as is". this paragraph is your golden ticket to a DPA breach should it be the case down the line

but to be pedantic, you are correct , so as I have told dozens of people before you, alter it to the past tense , because you are correct , its already done

so "Should you have obtained" (so add 6 letters to make it grammatically correct)

you will find some of my recent posts contain this phrase and some contain the whole wording suitably altered too

good luck

EpicBox

Redx wrote: »

the BPA CoP says nothing of the kind , please read clause #13

it has an unspecified period before the parking period, so that would be say 5 to 10 minutes , and a MINIMUM of 10 minutes to leave, so 15 minutes may be construed from those 2 paragraphs , but so could 21 minutes, or 16 minutes , so I err on the side of up to 21 minutes when I advise people, hence my post earlier

Am I looking at the right CoP? The forum won't let me post a link but I Googled "BPA code of practice" and chose the top boxed result (or the 3rd main result) which is v8.

Clause #13 is about getting driver data. The only part I see about a grace period relating to charges for overstay is Appendix B2.1: "The following vehicles must not be issued with a parking ticket: ... vehicles that have paid for parking and visibly display a payment ticket but have overstayed the ‘paid-for’ time displayed on the ticket by less than 5 minutes − unless they are committing some other breach of the regulations. You may only issue parking tickets after the
5-minute ‘grace’ period has run out. "

Redx

edit post #5 asap (see above)

here is the correct link

http://www.britishparking.co.uk/Code-of-Practice-and-compliance-monitoring

top one dated oct 2015 , version 6

see clause #13

13 Grace periods

13.1 Your approach to parking management must allow a driver who enters your car park but decides not to park, to leave the car park within a reasonable period without having their vehicle issued with a parking charge notice.

13.2 You should allow the driver a reasonable ‘grace period’ in which to decide if they are going to stay or go. If the driver is on your land without permission you should still allow them a grace period to read your signs and leave before you take enforcement action.

13.3 You should be prepared to tell us the specific grace period at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is.

13.4 You should allow the driver a reasonable period to leave the private car park after the parking contract has ended, before you take enforcement action. If the location is one where parking is normally permitted, the Grace Period at the end of the parking period should be a minimum of 10 minutes.

so clause #13 is much higher up than the appendix, ie:- page 9

ps:- scroll to the very bottom of the one you downloaded and it is dated 2009

Coupon-mad

You have a GOLDEN TICKET! Of course you will win if you don't say who was driving!!

You do not even need to mention Grace Periods - the keeper wins this appeal. Told you already:

Coupon-mad wrote: »

Yup, whatever you do, ONLY choose 'registered keeper' not 'driver'.

You may as well use the template from the NEWBIES thread, it stops people saying who was driving. Sounds like you have a golden ticket from PE (search the forum!). You win!!

So easy. You will win at POPLA; you will pay nothing.

Love Golden Tickets from PE!

KeithP

Post#5 still needs editing.



Post#1 needs similar adjustment.

Guys_Dad

And look at page 11 here too http://www.popla.co.uk/docs/default-source/default-document-library/popla-annual-report-2016.pdf?sfvrsn=2