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New tenants, who's responsibility is minor repairs?
saajan_12
Posts: 5,471 Forumite
I let a two bed property out to 2 young professionals (joint & several tenancy) who seem very responsible but are turning out to be rather inexperienced at maintaining a home. I manage the property myself, no agent. My current tenants have reported two issues which I think shouldn’t be my responsibility to resolve (or atleast ultimately pay for) but they are getting very disstressed saying they can’t live like this so I thought I’d check.
1) Room door handle broke/came off
Problem: They phoned me at 1am Sunday morning (I woke up thinking it was an emergency) saying that the inside door handle had come off when they tried to open the door, so they couldn’t turn the handle to open it. The rod/bar that lays horizontal in the door was pulled out with it, ,so the outside handle wouln’t turn the mechanism either. There was one person (tenant’s guest) inside the room at the time, without any tools to push the rod/bar through or re attach the handle. They wanted me to drive over to fix it or get an emergency locksmith. Luckily I talked them through how to take off the outside door handle and use a flat screwdriver to turn the mechanism in place of the rod which worked. However if this hadn’t worked, what should I have done?
- If there was a ‘proper’ agency many wouldn’t have an emergency number so they’d have to figure it out until working hours
- Never had this issue nor complaints of a loose door handle from the previous tenants (lived there 3 years) or in the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so sounds like a user error of too much force which broke the handle.
- I said they’d have to figure it out / call a tradesman / wait until the morning, but they kept saying it’s unlawful to expect the person inside the room (a guest) to ‘be held’ without a bathroom for 6 hours and the tenant without a bed for 6 hours (there is a couch!)
2) Infestation of insects in kitchen
They say they have tried and sprays to no avail and it seems the insects are laying eggs / multiplying. Again I have had no reports of any infestation or similar in the 3 years the previous tenants lived there or the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so it doesn’t seem to be an existing issue. Also, these tiny insects can enter the property from the tiniest of gaps / vents / open doors so short of making a house air tight (nigh on impossible), I don’t think it’s a building issue. They want me to get a professional exterminator in, but I think it must be due to rotting food / uncleanliness which is due to the tenants. Who’s responsibility is this / do I have to prove it’s the tenants or do they have to prove its mine? I have only visited the property once in the 3 months to deliver an extra drawer chest they requested but didn’t inspect the kitchen at the time.
TL/DR: New tenants call me for many minor issues, and are very distressed when I push back. Who's responsibility is a broken door handle locking someone in a room and an insect infestation when no precursors reported?
1) Room door handle broke/came off
Problem: They phoned me at 1am Sunday morning (I woke up thinking it was an emergency) saying that the inside door handle had come off when they tried to open the door, so they couldn’t turn the handle to open it. The rod/bar that lays horizontal in the door was pulled out with it, ,so the outside handle wouln’t turn the mechanism either. There was one person (tenant’s guest) inside the room at the time, without any tools to push the rod/bar through or re attach the handle. They wanted me to drive over to fix it or get an emergency locksmith. Luckily I talked them through how to take off the outside door handle and use a flat screwdriver to turn the mechanism in place of the rod which worked. However if this hadn’t worked, what should I have done?
- If there was a ‘proper’ agency many wouldn’t have an emergency number so they’d have to figure it out until working hours
- Never had this issue nor complaints of a loose door handle from the previous tenants (lived there 3 years) or in the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so sounds like a user error of too much force which broke the handle.
- I said they’d have to figure it out / call a tradesman / wait until the morning, but they kept saying it’s unlawful to expect the person inside the room (a guest) to ‘be held’ without a bathroom for 6 hours and the tenant without a bed for 6 hours (there is a couch!)
2) Infestation of insects in kitchen
They say they have tried and sprays to no avail and it seems the insects are laying eggs / multiplying. Again I have had no reports of any infestation or similar in the 3 years the previous tenants lived there or the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so it doesn’t seem to be an existing issue. Also, these tiny insects can enter the property from the tiniest of gaps / vents / open doors so short of making a house air tight (nigh on impossible), I don’t think it’s a building issue. They want me to get a professional exterminator in, but I think it must be due to rotting food / uncleanliness which is due to the tenants. Who’s responsibility is this / do I have to prove it’s the tenants or do they have to prove its mine? I have only visited the property once in the 3 months to deliver an extra drawer chest they requested but didn’t inspect the kitchen at the time.
TL/DR: New tenants call me for many minor issues, and are very distressed when I push back. Who's responsibility is a broken door handle locking someone in a room and an insect infestation when no precursors reported?
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Comments
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The door handle is their responsibility if they caused it to break ie using excess force in a temper-tantrum.
More likely it is wear & tear, or a poor quality handle, which are LL responsibility.
What kind of insects? How long have the tenants been there? Did you inspect before they moved in? Was there any sign then of a problem? Is the property in a rural area?
Reminds me of a time I brought home some shopping, put the meat on a shelf while I sorted the fridge, and forgot to put it in the freezer. Flies everywere. When I eventually found it it was crawling with maggots.........
It does sound like poor hygene may be the cause, in which case it's down to the tenants.
In your situation, I'd arrange to go round and look (though they might blitz-clean when they know you are coming....!). Use the opportunity not just to discuss the insects, but all other concerns they have, making clear what is and isn't their responsibility.
Unfortunately sometimes young, new renters just left home have ittle idea about managing a home for themselves, and need some guidance and perhaps more help than older tenants.0 -
At this moment in time you are just assuming its the tenants fault. I would suggest a visit and detailed inspection.
The door may have not fitted the opening properly (check hinges) needing more force to be used to open the door (happend to me a couple of times). The screws may have already been loose (more thorough inspection), or yes, the tenants may have broken the mechanism. But I am not sure how useful it is arguing whose responsibility it is. Its part of fixtures and fittings and unless you can prove the tenants had a party and decided to slam against the door handle, difficult to say its tenants fault.
Insects in your house? What kind? Could it be cockroaches?
Definitely inspection needed. Cockroaches are a nightmare. Yes they may love an unhygienic property but I moved into a place that had cockroaches and no way am I unhygienic. They were already there when I moved in.
If moths/flies it could be a hygiene problem. If they have been there for a couple of months, the problem might have already been in place. How long into their tenancy did they start complaining about 'insects'?
You really do need to do more thorough inspections, and in the case of this property perhaps more frequent ones.
Was a detailed check out and check in report done (very detailed)?0 -
I let a two bed property out to 2 young professionals (joint & several tenancy) who seem very responsible but are turning out to be rather inexperienced at maintaining a home. I manage the property myself, no agent. My current tenants have reported two issues which I think shouldn’t be my responsibility to resolve (or atleast ultimately pay for) but they are getting very disstressed saying they can’t live like this so I thought I’d check.
1) Room door handle broke/came off
Problem: They phoned me at 1am Sunday morning (I woke up thinking it was an emergency) saying that the inside door handle had come off when they tried to open the door, so they couldn’t turn the handle to open it. The rod/bar that lays horizontal in the door was pulled out with it, ,so the outside handle wouln’t turn the mechanism either. There was one person (tenant’s guest) inside the room at the time, without any tools to push the rod/bar through or re attach the handle. They wanted me to drive over to fix it or get an emergency locksmith. Luckily I talked them through how to take off the outside door handle and use a flat screwdriver to turn the mechanism in place of the rod which worked. However if this hadn’t worked, what should I have done?
- If there was a ‘proper’ agency many wouldn’t have an emergency number so they’d have to figure it out until working hours
- Never had this issue nor complaints of a loose door handle from the previous tenants (lived there 3 years) or in the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so sounds like a user error of too much force which broke the handle.
- I said they’d have to figure it out / call a tradesman / wait until the morning, but they kept saying it’s unlawful to expect the person inside the room (a guest) to ‘be held’ without a bathroom for 6 hours and the tenant without a bed for 6 hours (there is a couch!)
2) Infestation of insects in kitchen
They say they have tried and sprays to no avail and it seems the insects are laying eggs / multiplying. Again I have had no reports of any infestation or similar in the 3 years the previous tenants lived there or the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so it doesn’t seem to be an existing issue. Also, these tiny insects can enter the property from the tiniest of gaps / vents / open doors so short of making a house air tight (nigh on impossible), I don’t think it’s a building issue. They want me to get a professional exterminator in, but I think it must be due to rotting food / uncleanliness which is due to the tenants. Who’s responsibility is this / do I have to prove it’s the tenants or do they have to prove its mine? I have only visited the property once in the 3 months to deliver an extra drawer chest they requested but didn’t inspect the kitchen at the time.
TL/DR: New tenants call me for many minor issues, and are very distressed when I push back. Who's responsibility is a broken door handle locking someone in a room and an insect infestation when no precursors reported?
IMO, no they shouldn't be phoning you at 1am unless it was an emergency - a door handle coming off is not an emergency. I rather suspect that a little partying had been going on and they panicked. Couldn't they have used to internet to find out how to fix the door handle? Interesting they didn't phone their parents. A polite conversation that only emergencies will be accepted after ?pm should suffice. In any other scenario - letting agent/private owner - they would have had to sort it themselves.
Having said that you should pay for a new door handle and have it fixed (or do it yourself). I would recommend the latter as it would give you the ideal opportunity to have a look around re: kitchen.
As regards the infestation it is in your interest to have someone come out and investigate which insects they are, how they got in etc and how they can be exterminated.
If it turns out that it was from poor hygiene then you have two choices. Pay the first time and give them written guidelines about insect infestation and charge them the next time if it can be proved they were at fault. Or if it can be proved that they are at fault then charge them for this time or deduct from deposit if they don't pay up.
Next time you rent out, perhaps you ought to consider someone older and wiser!0 -
I let a two bed property out to 2 young professionals (joint & several tenancy) who seem very responsible but are turning out to be rather inexperienced at maintaining a home. I manage the property myself, no agent.
Do young professionals give you a higher rent than the 'normal' ones?
I am just an ordinary Joe, but I would say any part of the door is part of the building(your responsibility) and any infestation would result in a visit to look after your own property, maybe not on a Sunday morning.
Surely being a good landlord involves an occasional visit.0 -
They didn't need to take any handles off, just push the rod back in and it would have been able to be opened from outside.
The idea of needing an emegency locksmith is frankly crazy.0 -
Thanks for all the comments so far. I definitely do carry out inspections, usually semi-annual just haven’t yet with the current tenants in situ as they have only been in for just shy of 3 months. To clarify these were reported in two separate calls in the same week, the infestation was just this morning. I’m planning to visit tomorrow for both issues and will inspect the rest of the property too. I agree I am only assuming they are tenant issues, I guess I’m asking now so IF my suspicions are correct once I visit, I know what to look for / agree to / push back on.
Door handle- I guess my question is I’m not sure how this can be absolutely proved either way, so is it always my responsibility to pay for? I’m happy to replace the handle at my cost (no visible damage to the door, I can buy and put in the new handle/mechansim myself) but they were expecting someone to come out at 1am.. even if they didn’t call me but directly called an emergency locksmith, would I be responsible for the call out charge aswell (I imagine £150+ from a quick ring around)
Infestation- I have no idea what the species is, the tenants tell me they are <1mm wide so probably not cockroaches but I’ll confirm tomorrow. I did visit and cleaned the place myself before they moved in so there was definitely no sign of a problem then. It’s a terraced house in London, small garden with lawn but barely any significant greenery in sight!
And by ‘young professionals’ I just meant they are young people (first rental after uni) but not currently students so I thought / hoped there would be less partying if they have to be up at 8am!0 -
I would say in both cases it's yours, sorryI let a two bed property out to 2 young professionals (joint & several tenancy) who seem very responsible but are turning out to be rather inexperienced at maintaining a home. I manage the property myself, no agent. My current tenants have reported two issues which I think shouldn’t be my responsibility to resolve (or atleast ultimately pay for) but they are getting very disstressed saying they can’t live like this so I thought I’d check. - how long ago did they start to live there?
1) Room door handle broke/came off
Problem: They phoned me at 1am Sunday morning (I woke up thinking it was an emergency) saying that the inside door handle had come off when they tried to open the door, so they couldn’t turn the handle to open it. The rod/bar that lays horizontal in the door was pulled out with it, ,so the outside handle wouln’t turn the mechanism either. There was one person (tenant’s guest) inside the room at the time, without any tools to push the rod/bar through or re attach the handle. They wanted me to drive over to fix it or get an emergency locksmith. Luckily I talked them through how to take off the outside door handle and use a flat screwdriver to turn the mechanism in place of the rod which worked. However if this hadn’t worked, what should I have done?
- If there was a ‘proper’ agency many wouldn’t have an emergency number so they’d have to figure it out until working hours - irrelevant. Agency or not it's your responsibility to fix
- Never had this issue nor complaints of a loose door handle from the previous tenants (lived there 3 years) or in the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so sounds like a user error of too much force which broke the handle. - or more likely wear and tear.
- I said they’d have to figure it out / call a tradesman / wait until the morning, but they kept saying it’s unlawful to expect the person inside the room (a guest) to ‘be held’ without a bathroom for 6 hours and the tenant without a bed for 6 hours (there is a couch!) - Well opening the door to allow access would be their issue, repair is down to you in all likelihood
2) Infestation of insects in kitchen - almost certainly down to you, unless you can prove it's down to their neglect
They say they have tried and sprays to no avail and it seems the insects are laying eggs / multiplying. Again I have had no reports of any infestation or similar in the 3 years the previous tenants lived there or the 3 months the current tenants have lived there, so it doesn’t seem to be an existing issue. Also, these tiny insects can enter the property from the tiniest of gaps / vents / open doors so short of making a house air tight (nigh on impossible), I don’t think it’s a building issue. They want me to get a professional exterminator in, but I think it must be due to rotting food / uncleanliness which is due to the tenants. Who’s responsibility is this / do I have to prove it’s the tenants or do they have to prove its mine? I have only visited the property once in the 3 months to deliver an extra drawer chest they requested but didn’t inspect the kitchen at the time. - Not all insects are attracted to food, so until you know what type it is you cant be sure
TL/DR: New tenants call me for many minor issues, and are very distressed when I push back. Who's responsibility is a broken door handle locking someone in a room and an insect infestation when no precursors reported?0 -
Thanks for all the comments so far. I definitely do carry out inspections, usually semi-annual just haven’t yet with the current tenants in situ as they have only been in for just shy of 3 months. To clarify these were reported in two separate calls in the same week, the infestation was just this morning. I’m planning to visit tomorrow for both issues and will inspect the rest of the property too. I agree I am only assuming they are tenant issues, I guess I’m asking now so IF my suspicions are correct once I visit, I know what to look for / agree to / push back on.
Door handle- I guess my question is I’m not sure how this can be absolutely proved either way, so is it always my responsibility to pay for? I’m happy to replace the handle at my cost (no visible damage to the door, I can buy and put in the new handle/mechansim myself) but they were expecting someone to come out at 1am.. even if they didn’t call me but directly called an emergency locksmith, would I be responsible for the call out charge aswell (I imagine £150+ from a quick ring around)
Infestation- I have no idea what the species is, the tenants tell me they are <1mm wide so probably not cockroaches but I’ll confirm tomorrow. I did visit and cleaned the place myself before they moved in so there was definitely no sign of a problem then. It’s a terraced house in London, small garden with lawn but barely any significant greenery in sight!
And by ‘young professionals’ I just meant they are young people (first rental after uni) but not currently students so I thought / hoped there would be less partying if they have to be up at 8am!
aged 21/22 I used to be able to drink until 3 or 4 and make it in to the office for 9. these days not so much
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They didn't need to take any handles off, just push the rod back in and it would have been able to be opened from outside.
I agree, but partly due to the hysteria and stress since they had been trying for some time before they called, it was difficult to communicate with the person inside the room, but he couldn't manage to push it through accurately as the rod had come out of the cavity in the handle on the outside.0 -
I do understand your point - I mean I was 10 when my door handle broke, I simply put it back on, opened the door and told my parents.I agree, but partly due to the hysteria and stress since they had been trying for some time before they called, it was difficult to communicate with the person inside the room, but he couldn't manage to push it through accurately as the rod had come out of the cavity in the handle on the outside.
most young people aren't prepared for life which is a shame0
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