Sexual Discrimination - order for further and better partuculars

Curlygirl123

Hi all....
A friend of mine is due to attend an
employment Tribunal pre hearing soon. He has submitted a document which was requested before they meet. The respondent has filled in minimal detail in their portion of the form, instead compiling their answers in a separate referred to sheet. I'm not sure if this is tactical so they may change details later. The respondent has also sent an Order for Further and Better Partuculars. Does anyone know if they can Order this to be done or if at this stage it should just be a request?

They seem to be using it to see how strong the case is and as a scare tactic. There is a short time limit when the case management hasn't even beem discussed yet and the case won't be for months.

The information requested is all detailed in the grievance that the company dealt with and the appeal. They can find out the details themselves but seem to want to trip him up at this early stage.

Any experience or guidance welcomed. Thank you for reading

xapprenticex

didhedoit?

nicechap

OP's previous threads for info:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5618107

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5673585

Curlygirl123

Hello
....just to clarify he was discriminated against not the person discriminating

Thanks

nicechap

From the first thread.

Curlygirl123 wrote: »

......

The employee has been suspended on inaccurate information which has been evidenced and proven to be lies but no response from HR since. He has called ACAS in the hope they would mediate. The employee refused to mediate but a week later said relationships had broken down and they wanted to settle.
........

What was he suspended for? Was he then dismissed or did he resign?

Curlygirl123

Suspension was for relationship breakdown. Offered to return to position after appeal but no satisfactory resolution to repair relationships and admit any issues ever occurred by company. He resigned post

TBagpuss

The Respondent can't make orders. So either they have requested further and better particulars, or they have applied and the tribunal has made an order.

They may have sent a draft order on the basis that they will be requesting the tribunal to make the order if the additional information is not provided voluntarily.

I suggest that your friend gets proper legal advice.

They may be trying to employ scare tactics, they may simply be unfamiliar with the process and trying to do it without proper advice.

sangie595

TBagpuss wrote: »

The Respondent can't make orders. So either they have requested further and better particulars, or they have applied and the tribunal has made an order.

They may have sent a draft order on the basis that they will be requesting the tribunal to make the order if the additional information is not provided voluntarily.

I suggest that your friend gets proper legal advice.

They may be trying to employ scare tactics, they may simply be unfamiliar with the process and trying to do it without proper advice.

Mostly agree with this. An order is for the tribunal to make, but the employer can ask for such an order. I doubt that it is a scare tactic though - if you have a case there is nothing scary about it! What he thinks he has detailed, and to whom, is irrelevant. These orders are, put simply, to clarify the basis of the claim. They ate saying that there is not enough information to explain on what basis a claim is being made, or what that claim is for. It isn't up to them to look at their records to decide that - it's up to him to make it clear. If the tribunal agrees then he must comply. But there is no real reason not to. He had a strong case. Or he doesn't. He will have to outline the details of that case long before the tribunal anyway, so going some way towards that now is neither here nor there.

Such a request often, but not always, happens as a precursor to a request either for a deposit order or for a tribunal ruling on eligibility of the claim. Given this appears to be a constructive unfair dismissal and discrimination case, that would make sense. The employer is likely looking to get the case cleared away without a tribunal.

Curlygirl123

Thank you. From research that is what I understood. I think they are being aggressive. If they make a request, rather than an order, is a response essential or is it for judge to decide?

sangie595

It's for the judge to decide. The order, in effect, is a statement that there is not enough information in the application to determine what the claim is. But I doubt it is aggressive. It might feel that way, but this is just what lawyers do. It's the nature of the beast, being in a court of law. It isn't "personal" and if it were the tribunal would stamp on it.

Curlygirl123

Thanks for your help all. Can I ask another question?

A line manager says that if women shout at you its just the way they are, they get emotional and you should walk away......is that direct or indirect discrimination? The comment seems discriminatory to both the male being shouted and and towards females.

Breaking it down is confusing me somewhat.