Post-Brexit U.K. Car Sales Slump Seen Risking 18,000 German Jobs

movilogo

should the country leave the European Union’s single market and customs union

Without accepting freedom of movement of EU workers, UK can't stay inside single market. Since FOM is the main issue behind Brexit and based on recent news, UK wants to control FOM which means getting out of single market.

UK does have some negotiating power with as EU it seems.

mayonnaise

Conrad wrote: »

The 2 new aircraft carriers we are launching are another underlining of our projection of global power and influence.


As pointed out in the past, these are another ace to add to our hand given we are the main military safeguarding fleet of oil supplies coming into Europe.


UK is valuable strategic partner for Europe, I just with Remainers would get behind our strong negotiating hand and stop relentlessly painting us as a weak petitioner to be thrown scraps.

We currently have zero aircraft carrier capability. We're hitching a ride with the French.
HMS Queen Elizabeth and HMS Prince of Wales are about 100% over budget and years late.
Neither of the two will be commissioned before 2020.
Safeguarding oil supplies? Lol. We aren't even able to defend our own borders if it comes to it.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3793887/UK-not-protected-Russia-attack-retired-general-warns.html
(apologies for the DM link)

'Strong negotiating hand.' :rotfl:

A_Medium_Size_Jock

ilovehouses wrote: »

Electrification is the more immediate game changer. Cars will be easier to assemble and have less moving parts. I saw a factoid somewhere the other day that it's likely car charging points will outnumber petrol pumps in the next few months.

The automotive industry is going to be deskilled further and that's something to the detriment of high wage European car workers.

So yes, regardless of Brexit the UK needs to think hard about the transition. The last thing we need in the future is people who have been unemployed 20 years still calling themselves car workers in the same way miners did.

Agreed, electrification will indeed probably be a greater game-changer but "immediate"?
And "it's likely car charging points will outnumber petrol pumps in the next few months."
Much though I really do wish that were so, that is not likely.

Firstly the technology for electrification is nowhere near mature enough yet, despite the best efforts of companies like Tesla.
(BTW I see Aston Martin's plans for an electric model has had to be scaled back after the withdrawal of a Chinese investor.)
Which, bluntly, means that the range is really not yet good enough for many, including those living outside major conurbations.

Secondly without searching apps first, you don't know where a charging point is if you need one; certainly not every petrol station has a charging point for instance.
This BTW, the very appropriately-named "Zap-map", shows you where points are:
https://www.zap-map.com/live/


I would love to see electric cars becoming more mainstream very soon and within hopefully not too long I'm sure they will, but in the very near future?
Sadly not.

Conrad

mayonnaise wrote: »

Neither of the two will be commissioned before 2020.
Safeguarding oil supplies? Lol. We aren't even able to defend our own borders if it comes to it.

Take it up with Andrew Neil and Newsnight, both of which have claimed one of the UK's bargaining chips is the fact we are the primary security detail when it comes to safeguarding the Straights of Hormuz ('key chokepoint') through which comes much of Europe's oil.


I don't have a link - I had one but deleted it a while back. It was in the old Brexit thread, sometime last year.

Herzlos

For anyone doing any medium mileage (say, 5-20k/year) then electric/phev is a very tempting proposition. The only reason you'd choose diesel now is for huge mileage (where recharging isn't viable) - taxis, sales reps, etc, or for the car themselves.

Conrad wrote: »

As we said all along, reality will hit hard, a deal will be done.
See my signature...

I agree entirely; reality will hit hard and a deal will be done.

But not for the reasons you state. And I doubt you'll like the deal. I doubt anyone will like the deal, to be honest.

A_Medium_Size_Jock

ilovehouses wrote: »

The Queen's Speech did indicate the government were going to attempt to really try and push the infrastructure. Company car tax is also a huge incentive for a push towards electric/ phev and therefore the used market too. Charging points are also heavily subsidised. The small company I work for is assuming every employee will require a charging point within the next 3 years.

I've loved my BMW diesels but even I've moved to phev - the tax savings are almost impossible to ignore. Slightly worried about whether I've got the Betamax but I'll be saving c£220/ month as I wait to find out.

We're heading towards large scale electrification of all personal transport transport. Will it be 2020 or 2030? Time will tell.

Time will indeed tell and technology as we know has this habit of surprising us; the hydrogen fuel cell may well become the VHS of this battle. Maybe.

Toyota's hydrogen gamble

http://macaudailytimes.com.mo/files/pdf2017/FT-2776-2017-04-03.pdf

An explanation and a review for those who might be unaware of the technology:
https://www.driveclean.ca.gov/Search_and_Explore/Technologies_and_Fuel_Types/Hydrogen_Fuel_Cell.php

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/hyundai/ix35-fuel-cell

Herzlos

Hydrogen fuel has it's uses, but it's just not as convenient or safe as electric.
It's harder to produce (using electricity to split the water - you may as well just keep the electricity), harder to transmit, harder to store, flammable & pressurised, can't be refuelled from anywhere with electric source (unless you have your own splitter).

For use off-grid it's great, but not for everything else. I could see us getting to a point where we drop petrol/diesel and vehicles are either electric/hydrogen.

GreatApe

The future is computer driven car fleets.

The cars will be designed to do 500,000 miles over three years and then scrapped. That is a lot better than the current average car which probably does 100,000 miles over 12 years and then is scrapped.

These fleets could potentially charge customers as little as 10p a mile.

Conrad

ilovehouses wrote: »

An Australian state will install the world's largest lithium ion battery in a "historic" deal with electric car firm Tesla and energy company Neoen.

Bur remainers are arguing in the other thread an independent Britain will be isolated and cut off.


Once again the evidence is clear, independent nations are not in any sense cut off.