Paying training fees back

Rachylou1981

Hi all


When a company pays a qualification/training course for an employee and they leave, is it a legally binding contract to pay the fees back?


Yes he did sign a contract but this was 6 months AFTER he started the course and he needed the qualification to do the job they wanted him to do - he was going to leave and they persuaded him to stay on a different career path which was too good of an opp to turn down.

Malthusian

Maybe. Just because you haven't signed a contract (at the time) it doesn't mean there isn't one. If, for example, the employee handbook says that you have to repay training costs if you leave within a certain time, that forms part of his employment contract. What does his original employment contract or the employee handbook (if any) say?

The fact that he signed the new contract six months after the fact does not help him much if it represented company policy at the time he started the course and the company can prove it.

How long ago was this? If he changed his mind about leaving, did the course, then left anyway six months later once he'd secured the qualification, he probably is liable to pay it back. If he isn't, the company has been very careless.

Oakdene

He may well be liable, sometimes what companies do is say we will spend £x to train you to do this job but if you leave within 12 months of completion you have to pay it all back. They may also reduce the amount due to be paid back the longer the employee stays before they leave.

Rachylou1981

Unsure about his contract.


He started the course/qualification straight away in 2015 as it was essential for the new role but he didn't sign the contract about payment of fees until six months later. The course didn't complete until this year, 2017.


I've seen the contract which is quite brutal and states 100% of course fees must be paid if he leaves within 12 months of completion (which was just this year). They will take from his wages and anything outstanding needs to be paid within one month.


It's almost 5K and we just don't have that money. I am not sure how they would enforce it but if he has signed then I'm assuming we don't have a leg to stand on??

Oakdene

But if he has signed the contract then he may well be liable. I would be amazed if they can take it from his final salary however he could agree to repay over x months.

Rachylou1981

Oakdene wrote: »

But if he has signed the contract then he may well be liable. I would be amazed if they can take it from his final salary however he could agree to repay over x months.

I think he is going to request that and hope they give him a bit of a break. It's a lot of money to pay back at once.


It says in the contract about taking it out of wages too although most say it's illegal to do so - the fact that he's signed that makes me wonder if that is still the case

Malthusian

If he'd stayed long enough to complete the qualification and then immediately jumped ship, and they couldn't reclaim the money, it would be quite brutal for the employer to have paid him an extra £5,000 bonus for absolutely nothing.

As Oakdene says, if they are reasonable they should be willing to accept payment in instalments for an amount that size (despite what the contract says). It's in their interests to come to an agreement rather than take him to court.

Presumably this qualification enhances his prospects in the wider industry?

£5,000 is a hell of a lot of money. My own professional qualification would have cost around £1,750 to pay for out of my own pocket (maybe £3k if I needed extra coaching or re-takes) and on its own is probably worth around £10k extra in salary, or £20k+ in the right role. Which means it pays for itself fairly quickly. Your personal finances aren't any of my business but does it take him a long time to earn £5,000 in disposable income if he's in a profession that takes £5,000 to qualify for?

*edit*

Rachylou1981 wrote: »

It says in the contract about taking it out of wages too although most say it's illegal to do so

Most who? Employers certainly can make deductions from wages for training if it is authorised by the worker's contract.

Rachylou1981

Malthusian - It sounds pretty bad when you put it like that but the employer has messed partner around with redundancy threat and an actual dismissal (he was found not at fault and re-instated after legal advice). This prompted him to want to leave. He planned to stay with the company for a 5 year job plan - which was changed only a year in. Anyway, that's a separate issue I guess...


I don't want to go into too much detail but the qualification allowed him to go into a completely different field of work but he needed it to do so - employers encouraged and offered a job plan to keep him in the company which included the qualification. For example, it's like an office manager in the police force being asked to stay and become a policeman - they would need a different set of skills and training.

Can't quite answer the money question but his pay did not reflect what the qualification did for the company and others got paid more for same job (another reason for leaving). However it has enabled him to get the other job.


Most means google searches and people in real life - sorry, not very reliable

martinsurrey

Rachylou1981 wrote: »

He started the course/qualification straight away in 2015 as it was essential for the new role but he didn't sign the contract about payment of fees until six months later. The course didn't complete until this year, 2017.

It's almost 5K and we just don't have that money. I am not sure how they would enforce it but if he has signed then I'm assuming we don't have a leg to stand on??

I doubt the course was paid 100% up front, so in the last few years they have paid a significant sum on the training while he knew he would have to repay if he left...

and by continuing on the course, he has implied his consent to repay.

I really doubt he has a leg to stand on.

Vectis

But, come on, why wouldn't you want to pay it back? They paid for his education on the basis that he would stay with them, and he even signed an agreement to that effect. But now that he's got the qualification, he wants to leave? Fair enough, but he needs to pay the company back the amount he agreed.

From a legal aspect as well as morally, he owes them the cost of the course.

Rachylou1981

Vectis wrote: »

But, come on, why wouldn't you want to pay it back? They paid for his education on the basis that he would stay with them, and he even signed an agreement to that effect. But now that he's got the qualification, he wants to leave? Fair enough, but he needs to pay the company back the amount he agreed.

From a legal aspect as well as morally, he owes them the cost of the course.

There's more to the story in that the company have gone back on their word to what they promised him and also unfairly dismissed him at one stage - this is why he is leaving.


Of course we are not just saying we are not paying it, we do have morals and understand this has given him a new career. We are going to negotiate with them and my partner has started doing so. We just wanted to get our facts right if they actually take his last wage and say he must pay it all in one month, which is a huge amount of money